CraftOS 2.0 - Dan's Secret Project - ComputerCraft Forums (archive)

Bomb Bloke #1

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Posted 18 April 2015 - 04:17 PM

I'm not one for checking twitter, but I had this pointed out to me:

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/589109112560099328

Something to look forward to. :)/>/>

Edit:

Since the starting of this thread, some more information has surfaced (mainly through Dan's twitter, but partly through the posts here) as to what this's all about:

Seems Dan's creating a Lua environment similar to that provided by ComputerCraft computers, but as a stand-alone package (outside of Minecraft) and geared towards aiding new programmers in game development. A lot of details are still unknown, though browsing his twitter feed reveals various screenshots and animations of its progress.

While still simulating limitations of older systems in order to inspire a retro theme (eg 4-bit colour depth), new features such as sound, higher display resolution (320x200), and a remappable palette make it more dynamic than what's possible within CC. Tools such as sprite and sound effect editors will be included - the "edit" script will provide different functionality depending on the type of file you point it at.

There is no concrete schedule for release, though Dan has stated that he intends to fully complete development of Redirection first. He's continued to work on COS2.0 since then, however, so anything's possible.

CraftedCart has been maintaining a list of what's been hinted at (along with relevant links), which you can view here.

Edited on 29 November 2015 - 10:36 PM

SquidDev #2

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Posted 18 April 2015 - 04:21 PM

I can't tell if that is unicode or just normal ASCII. There looked like there were some non-ASCII characters there, but it was hard to tell. It will be interesting to see some new UIs make use of this. I wonder if it will be advance computer only though?

~~I guess it might just be a custom font, this was linked to from a suggestion a while back…as~~
This was the original suggestion, and this was the new one. Very excited!

Edited on 18 April 2015 - 02:24 PM

Bomb Bloke #3

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Posted 18 April 2015 - 04:29 PM

There are swords and skulls in there, so it's definitely not ASCII, or even code page 437 (which is probably the most common extended set). Likewise, Unicode wouldn't have creeper faces in it.

One this that gets me is that in order to render that sort of thing, CC would either need to be able to define custom characters on the fly, or it'd need to be able to handle characters outside of the standard ASCII range. The latter seems most likely to me, and it suggests a certain long-standing bug may've been sorted out perhaps?

MKlegoman357 #4

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 18 April 2015 - 05:18 PM

I'd say the character set could be just an extended current ASCII to 256 characters. One thing that seems non-CC is that pixels in the gif are squares, not rectangles as in CC.

SquidDev #5

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Posted 18 April 2015 - 05:22 PM

I also count 17 pixels high, whereas a normal computer has 19. Maybe something to do with this 'brand new secret project', though it definitely looks Minecraft related.

Edited on 18 April 2015 - 03:22 PM

TheOddByte #6

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Posted 18 April 2015 - 05:25 PM

I didn't think this would be added, but now that I've seen that tweet I'm extremely excited! :D/>
I have to check out twitter more often! xP

Agent Silence #7

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Posted 18 April 2015 - 06:21 PM

Square Pixels :o/>
Besides that, the characters could work like stencils in OpenBlocks.
If they did, it would be amazing.

Edited on 18 April 2015 - 04:24 PM

CrazedProgrammer #8

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 18 April 2015 - 06:58 PM

Aww yiss can't wait to make some ASCII art :D/>

Dav999_NL #9

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Posted 19 April 2015 - 12:18 AM

This looks surprisingly similar to something I've seen before:

(imagine characters changing here as well)

Creator #10

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Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 19 April 2015 - 12:36 AM

Is there any doubt if it in CC, or it just something to give us false hopes? If yes, imagine the possibilities:
1) square pixels (luckily all my programs,at least fileX, use term.getSize() and not hardcoded values)
2) Acsii graphics insert cool meme that guy who is running with his hands over his head/ behind him

Bomb Bloke #11

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Posted 19 April 2015 - 01:59 AM

Dav999_NL, on 19 April 2015 - 12:18 AM said:
This looks surprisingly similar to something I've seen before:

Now that's Unicode. Still, the resemblance is uncanny.

Creator, on 19 April 2015 - 12:36 AM said:
Is there any doubt if it in CC, or it just something to give us false hopes? If yes, imagine the possibilities:

It may be that it's unrelated to ComputerCraft. Certainly I hadn't noticed that the aspect ratio was off.

Maybe it's a new kinda of "monitor" or something? I really dunno.

nitrogenfingers #12

513 posts

Location Australia

Posted 22 April 2015 - 05:37 AM

Two things I noticed in that video:
- The colour palette is about the same as CC's
- There's a CC turtle character, a rectangle with a slit near the top

But that's just speculation…

Edited on 22 April 2015 - 04:02 AM

Lupus590 #13

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 01:04 PM

floppy disk icon at the top left too (see nirtogenfingers screenshot above)

wieselkatze #14

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 02:10 PM

Also there is a sword char:

And much more obvious a creeper character:

Cranium #15

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 08:21 PM

this would be VERY nice to see in CC. To me, it looks like a modified version of some character set that is games-specific. I see things like humans, pac-man(and ghosts), bombs, a dog, what looks like a gravestone, something like a goomba, half of a Space Invader, skulls, and of course, what you guys have noticed.

I'd love to see even a small portion of this in ComputerCraft.

EDIT: Oh, and what looks like a "slime" enemy

Edited on 22 April 2015 - 06:29 PM

Wojbie #16

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Posted 22 April 2015 - 09:27 PM

Text based old-school (text-based old) standalone console adventure game? :D/>

MKlegoman357 #17

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Posted 03 May 2015 - 08:51 PM

wojbie, on 22 April 2015 - 09:27 PM said:
Text based old-school (text-based old) standalone console adventure game? :D/>

Looks like you might be right.

For those who don't read Dan's twitter, he's making a secret project, his next game. So it seems that it's not a CC font extension after all.

Edited on 03 May 2015 - 06:52 PM

Bomb Bloke #18

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Posted 03 May 2015 - 11:55 PM

The partial implementation of Lua 5.2 into the CC beta + the MineCraft-based glyphs have had me thinking "ComputerCraft 2" is in the works.

Whatever it is, he appears to be running a lightly modified version of ComputerCraft's worm script on it.

MKlegoman357 #19

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Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 04 May 2015 - 07:36 AM

Maybe Dan is creating a standalone CC-based game?

Bomb Bloke #20

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Posted 05 May 2015 - 04:55 AM

The MineCraft-themed symbols make me think otherwise, but… it's perfectly possible!

Adding in eg something like the interface from CCEdu would differentiate it from every other CC "emulator" out there.

Slackratchet #21

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Posted 06 May 2015 - 04:41 PM

Now I want Dwarf Fortress running on a monitor in my base. :)/>

SquidDev #22

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Posted 06 May 2015 - 05:09 PM

I'm thinking this is a Computer Craft related thing again. Maybe another spoiler?

Bomb Bloke #23

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Posted 06 May 2015 - 06:13 PM

Really that sequence of tweets makes me lean further towards "not ComputerCraft".

"Hey, why's ComputerCraft popular?"

"What if I took out the turtles?"

"Um, rather, what if I took out everything that lets you interact with your MineCraft world?" (In response to people reminding him that ComputerCraft can automate via eg redstone and peripherals as well)

So number four, "What could I add to ComputerCraft to make it fun to use?", comes off as having the unspoken implication "… when you're using it outside of MineCraft?".

Dan probably won't read this here, but what the heck, I'm not making a twitter account just to say it (someone can link this post from there if they're feeling generous) - one thing I'd really like to play with again is VDU 23, for defining your own characters. Had all sorts of fun with that as a kid.

Whatever's planned seems to be built with the idea that you can easily use most existing ComputerCraft code with it (so long as that code doesn't rely on a MineCraft world, anyway - but let's assume stuff that Lua doesn't usually have, like the paintutils API, is still available). Dynamic character definitions would mean that if I wanted to, for eg, port across my tetris game, I could use the same "graphics built out of text characters" system I'm using now, and if the character set on offer happens to be missing a suitable block-symbol, I can add one in myself.

Likewise, something like eg Gold Runner could be much more readily customised to use "proper graphics" if the character set were malleable. Furthermore, if scripts don't need to be re-written to use "regular" drawing functions in order to "draw new stuff", it'd be relatively easy to write a single copy of a script that runs in what I'm assuming will be a new environment, as well as in ComputerCraft - backwards compatibility!

dan200 #24

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Posted 07 May 2015 - 05:02 PM

I'm really enjoying the speculation in this thread :)/>

Creator #25

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Posted 07 May 2015 - 05:22 PM

dan200, on 07 May 2015 - 05:02 PM said:
I'm really enjoying the speculation in this thread :)/>

I think you are feeling like a superior force manipulating us and having fun… ;)/>

Bomb Bloke #26

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Posted 07 May 2015 - 11:48 PM

Heh, well he clearly doesn't want to give the secret away! :lol:/>

Antelux #27

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Posted 08 May 2015 - 12:06 AM

I think we might be looking at some kind of ComputerCraft 2.0 thing after all.
Can't wait to see what this is. It'll be a huge boost of graphics for games like my own, assuming we can use it do so. OS's will probably look way better, too.

EDIT: Made it sound like it was completely unrelated to ComputerCraft. Changed.

Edited on 10 May 2015 - 11:09 AM

MKlegoman357 #28

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Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 10 May 2015 - 12:56 PM

Another interesting screenshot

The auto-completion and color scheme really reminds ComputerCraft. Could this actually be ComputerCraft 2.0?

EDIT: notice the font - it's not the default MineCraft font.

Edited on 10 May 2015 - 11:02 AM

CrazedProgrammer #29

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 10 May 2015 - 01:05 PM

MKlegoman357, on 10 May 2015 - 12:56 PM said:
Another interesting screenshot

The auto-completion and color scheme really reminds ComputerCraft. Could this actually be ComputerCraft 2.0?

EDIT: notice the font - it's not the default MineCraft font.

It could be CC 2.0 because of the autocompletion and commands :D/>

Geforce Fan #30

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Posted 11 May 2015 - 02:03 AM

I'd be excited and afraid for CC 2.0
I hope there'd be some sort of way to port CC 1.0 programs to it.
edit: Related?

Edited on 11 May 2015 - 12:07 AM

Bomb Bloke #31

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Posted 11 May 2015 - 02:11 AM

Geforce Fan, on 11 May 2015 - 02:03 AM said:
I hope there'd be some sort of way to port CC 1.0 programs to it.

I'd imagine that many scripts (well, other than ones which use peripherals/redstone/turtles/etc) will work as-is.

nitrogenfingers #32

513 posts

Location Australia

Posted 13 May 2015 - 07:54 AM

MKlegoman357, on 10 May 2015 - 12:56 PM said:
Another interesting screenshot

Oh now that is interesting…

Allow me to further, totally baselessly speculate. I'd proffer one of CC's greater achievements is providing such an accessible environment for budding programmers, perhaps this is in the direction of a standalone tool with that sort of 'easy to experiment' mentality in mind? A lot (far from a majority but a lot) of stuff posted here doesn't explicitly need minecraft to work, or even be useful or interesting in whatever context there is after all. Perhaps this is inspired or even somehow linked with the work being done on CCEdu.

MKlegoman357 #33

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Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 15 May 2015 - 05:43 PM

Yet another screenshot.

Looks like the color pallet is wider than CC's (at least more shades of grey), maybe 32 colors.

Cranium #34

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Posted 15 May 2015 - 05:50 PM

That kinda confirms that this probably isn't for ComputerCraft as we know it. Likely something completely separate.

MKlegoman357 #35

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Posted 15 May 2015 - 06:00 PM

That's why I'm sticking with this now:

MKlegoman357, on 04 May 2015 - 07:36 AM said:
Maybe Dan is creating a standalone CC-based game?

Bomb Bloke #36

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Posted 15 May 2015 - 11:32 PM

Dan had been toying with the idea of adding more colours to CC, shortly before starting his "secret project":

http://www.computercraft.info/forums2/index.php?/topic/22826-selecting-a-color-palette-im-not-suggestion-more-than-16-colors-but-rather-a-way-to-customize-them-in-game/

That said, by this point I've long since been convinced it's not "CC for MineCraft".

MKlegoman357 #37

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Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 16 May 2015 - 04:38 PM

A tile map editor?

So now it looks like it's a CC-based game in which, just like in ComputerCraft, you can create any program you want, but is mainly meant for very easily creating games.

ebernerd #38

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Posted 16 May 2015 - 06:38 PM

I seriously think that with the very similar syntax of the ComputerCraft (i.e "edit namehere"), we might get some sort of ComputerCraft thing. It might not be in game, however, it might be some sort of external "emulator" or something that can be it's own "game".

Whatever it is… I WANT IT NOW. xD

Bomb Bloke #39

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 01:52 AM

I would guess that the "edit" script looks at the filename extension to figure out that you want to deal with sprites instead of text? Dunno.

The pipes put me in mind of Mario.

ebernerd #40

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 02:29 AM

Maybe… just maybe….

Maybe the edit function detects the file extension and you can configure what program opens which extension by default. That would be cool, and actually pretty easy to do.

TheOddByte #41

1852 posts

Location Sweden

Posted 18 May 2015 - 05:20 PM

We can safely asume that it isn't ComputerCraft he's working on https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/599582611795742720

ardera #42

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463 posts

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 08:02 PM

~~LuaJ has inbuilt unicode support (I think), it's possible that he now decided to use it~~

Seeing the later responds this thread, and the other tweets of dan200, I don't think it's computercraft what he's working on

Edited on 19 May 2015 - 10:21 AM

Lignum #43

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 08:22 PM

To me it seems like it's some sort of game development kit for people coming from ComputerCraft. This would make sense since he always includes #gamedev in his tweets, and not to forget this game-looking thing.
Additionally, ComputerCraft has always been an educational mod, so I suppose the new thing is a sort of ComputerCraft 2.0, a new challenge for those who have mastered the original?

Creator #44

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 08:40 PM

It definately looks similar to CC. However it still shows some differences.

Wojbie #45

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Posted 19 May 2015 - 07:53 PM

Well look at this

Whatever end project will be it will have a lot of overlap with CC. That means that there will be a community of people that know most of what is going on with it and are willing to help other. And if some of that overlap upgrades sneak its way back into CC? No-one will complain. Cause most of us here is liking what he is doing in those posts.

Edited on 19 May 2015 - 05:53 PM

Cranium #46

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Posted 19 May 2015 - 08:08 PM

Well that's very interesting. That's very clearly similar to CC's own inbuilt edit program, if not exactly the same. I think Dan is reading this thread, and actively putting out teaser images just to throw us off.
*shakes fist at dan200*

CrazedProgrammer #47

546 posts

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Posted 19 May 2015 - 08:14 PM

I'm so excited!

MindenCucc #48

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Posted 19 May 2015 - 08:27 PM

It looks like graphics.com ported to ComputerCraft :P/> graphics.setMode(19)? :D/>

Lyqyd #49

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Posted 19 May 2015 - 08:29 PM

The code in the above video is interesting. Wonder what all else the "gfx" API can do?

SquidDev #50

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Posted 19 May 2015 - 09:02 PM

I'm stuck between 'this can't be on CC, because this would cause so much network lag, etc…' and 'all these sneak peaks, it must be CC because he knows we will be really upset when it isn't'. I guess I'm just going to have to get in my TARDIS and pop forwards a couple of weeks.

Seriously though, even if this isn't for CC it is going to be pretty awesome. Judging by previous tweets, gfx might be also be able to do 3D…

HDeffo #51

213 posts

Posted 20 May 2015 - 06:08 PM

If you notice while maintaining a LOT of CC's design aspects these screenshots and gifs have slowly grown farther from the CC we know. At first it was new characters with slightly odd resolution size for a CC computer. Then we added new resolution sizes seemingly changeable. Then the ability to draw lines and define your own characters. And now the 'custom' defined characters have gotten much more complex and new colors have been added. I believe I read once before Dan stating in theory yes he could remove computercraft's rendering restrictions in terms of color and size but to avoid murdering the server it would require a flat out complete rewrite of the entire mod and I feel like he also stated it would be extremely difficult if he even did attempt this. This actually seems to go perfectly with the fact this seems to be slowly as if through a long progress be getting more and more complex over time. I believe dan's 'secret' project is a complete rewrite of how computercraft renders and thus a practical rewrite of computercraft altogether. While the latest animations look almost nothing like computercraft except a few quirks if you look at them in order its almost like an evolution from computercraft as each new "feature" is fleshed out.

Creator #52

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Posted 20 May 2015 - 06:18 PM

If what you are saying is true, then not only would Dan slowly replace GabeN as our Lord, but also itwill be the best mod ever. And the internet will explode since it won't be able to handle the awesomeness of Dan and ComputerCraft.

HDeffo #53

213 posts

Posted 20 May 2015 - 06:46 PM

Dan's secret project: Become overlord of the internet

Creator #54

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 20 May 2015 - 07:02 PM

Poor GabeN, already losing popularity, and now comes Dan. He can't handle that.

Agent Silence #55

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 05:49 AM

Anyone else getting carpal tunnel from refreshing Dan's twitter feed so many times?
I can't wait any longer or else I will start breaking my bones XD

jerimo #56

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 07:28 AM

I love how no one has mentioned that the edit list Gif literally makes a mention of CC and how one needs to press Ctrl to save by saying that one will "never need to press Ctrl again"

Bomb Bloke #57

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 08:43 AM

I for one am assuming that the unspoken exception to that is "unless you're still actually using ComputerCraft".

oeed #58

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 08:52 AM

If this is indeed the case I'll be strongly considering giving OneOS and Bedrock a bit of a kick into gear, this really does mean a whole array of new possibilities.

Bomb Bloke #59

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 09:42 AM

We know that whatever it is will be running something akin to CraftOS by default, so… why not do that anyway?

theoriginalbit #60

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Location Australia

Posted 21 May 2015 - 11:09 AM

Well it's definitely not CCEdu related.

You all missed these btw:

Also it seems that Dan is taking a page out of every single one of my programs, first with peripheral.find, now with this expect and the __type in the metatable :P/>

Edited on 21 May 2015 - 11:53 AM

Wojbie #61

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 01:47 PM

__type in the metatable? How did i miss that tweet. Damn that will make some fun stuff when making api's with it.

theoriginalbit #62

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 02:00 PM

wojbie, on 21 May 2015 - 01:47 PM said:
__type in the metatable? How did i miss that tweet. Damn that will make some fun stuff when making api's with it.

you've always been able to do it, its just the default type function never used it. But it was easy enough to add in by overriding the type function.

Wojbie #63

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Location Kinda lost

Posted 21 May 2015 - 02:22 PM

theoriginalbit, on 21 May 2015 - 02:00 PM said:
you've always been able to do it, its just the default type function never used it. But it was easy enough to add in by overriding the type function.

Yes true but this way is more fun. And i kinda dislike overwriting functions - you never know what errors it can cause in someone else code. But this? This is a standard and noone can rip me a new one for (ab)using it!

Edited on 21 May 2015 - 12:29 PM

nitrogenfingers #64

513 posts

Location Australia

Posted 21 May 2015 - 02:33 PM

Well so long as you stick to spec, none right?

This is all very exciting, but it's so clearly linked to computercraft yet almost probably not actually computercraft, it's doing my head in reading this thread…

Agent Silence #65

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 06:06 PM

If you take a close look at the tweet with the save icon(HERE)
The disk icon is out of line with the text, and it isn't proportional to the text.
Also, I'd think that if each of those icons took up a pixel, this and this wouldn't be possible

–UPON FURTHER INVESTIGATION–
The gfx API is most likely a reimplementation of the paintutils API
Also, new font api maybe?

Edited on 21 May 2015 - 04:10 PM

Cranium #66

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 06:31 PM

Requiem of Silence, on 21 May 2015 - 06:06 PM said:
Also, I'd think that if each of those icons took up a pixel, this and this wouldn't be possible

Unless it's an implementation of more and smaller pixels. If that's the case, then it's entirely plausible to think that those characters are created using a much higher pixel resolution.

MKlegoman357 #67

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 21 May 2015 - 07:41 PM

Requiem of Silence, on 21 May 2015 - 06:06 PM said:
If you take a close look at the tweet with the save icon(HERE)
The disk icon is out of line with the text, and it isn't proportional to the text.
Also, I'd think that if each of those icons took up a pixel, this and this wouldn't be possible

–UPON FURTHER INVESTIGATION–
The gfx API is most likely a reimplementation of the paintutils API
Also, new font api maybe?

If you look at the 'X' button you'll see that it is not aligned to letters (look above it). Also, this and other images clearly show that the pixels are managed separately. If this is ComputerCraft then the 'gfx' library is now the lowest level drawing API and 'term' API becomes just a wrapper to 'gfx' library to support writing of characters and for backwards compatibility. I'd say that a font API might also exist here. At least these are my speculations for now.

oeed #68

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 11:05 PM

By the look of those screen shots, this is not just a custom font… ooooooo boy :D/>

MindenCucc #69

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 11:11 PM

If this secret project is not a new graphics engine for CC, it may be a custom game engine/emulator. Or a CC-ish Lua-programmed GameMaker in Minecraft perhaps?

theoriginalbit #70

7508 posts

Location Australia

Posted 22 May 2015 - 12:13 AM

wojbie, on 21 May 2015 - 02:22 PM said:
Yes true but this way is more fun.

How is a function provided by Dan more fun than the exact same function implemented yourself?

nitrogenfingers, on 21 May 2015 - 02:33 PM said:
This is all very exciting, but it's so clearly linked to computercraft yet almost probably not actually computercraft, it's doing my head in reading this thread…

Personally I'm thinking it could be a project which he could be testing new ideas/concepts on and potentially based off our reaction to that could potentially bring some (if not all) to ComputerCraft. Some things that are being done look and sound very clearly for CC others not. Some things stated also don't say they're for the secret project. There are a lot of assumptions going on in this thread, it could be possible that he is simply working on multiple things at once.

Edited on 21 May 2015 - 10:15 PM

Bomb Bloke #71

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Posted 22 May 2015 - 01:03 AM

Requiem of Silence, on 21 May 2015 - 06:06 PM said:
If you take a close look at the tweet with the save icon(HERE)
The disk icon is out of line with the text, and it isn't proportional to the text.

The "how primitive" example gives me the impression that it's possible to simply "draw" characters where ever you want.

Wojbie #72

724 posts

Location Kinda lost

Posted 22 May 2015 - 02:06 AM

theoriginalbit, on 22 May 2015 - 12:13 AM said:
How is a function provided by Dan more fun than the exact same function implemented yourself?

If Dan makes it it becomes a standard for all. If I define it then in 99% of cases it will not work with other people code.

theoriginalbit #73

7508 posts

Location Australia

Posted 22 May 2015 - 03:16 AM

wojbie, on 22 May 2015 - 02:06 AM said:
If Dan makes it it becomes a standard for all. If I define it then in 99% of cases it will not work with other people code.

well you can always restore the old function, but little things like checking if there is a __type on the metatable wouldn't break anyone else's code.

Edited on 22 May 2015 - 01:16 AM

Wojbie #74

724 posts

Location Kinda lost

Posted 22 May 2015 - 04:31 AM

theoriginalbit, on 22 May 2015 - 03:16 AM said:
wojbie, on 22 May 2015 - 02:06 AM said:
If Dan makes it it becomes a standard for all. If I define it then in 99% of cases it will not work with other people code.
well you can always restore the old function, but little things like checking if there is a __type on the metatable wouldn't break anyone else's code.

And what if someone else has uses _type in their programme and is expecting type to return 'table'? Then he uses his own type2 function to check if it's one he is looking for? Bam! No table from type code fails and I am to blame.

theoriginalbit #75

7508 posts

Location Australia

Posted 22 May 2015 - 05:21 AM

Uh no, but sure.

Wojbie #76

724 posts

Location Kinda lost

Posted 22 May 2015 - 07:55 AM

Ok let's agree to disagree. Going back to topic of this thread. I believe that Dan is making modified version of Lau geared towards standalone gamemaking with awesome pixel graphics and (wild guess there) 8bit music.

oeed #77

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 22 May 2015 - 08:40 AM

wojbie, on 22 May 2015 - 07:55 AM said:
Ok let's agree to disagree. Going back to topic of this thread. I believe that Dan is making modified version of Lau geared towards standalone gamemaking with awesome pixel graphics and (wild guess there) 8bit music.

The main thing that makes me this that this is ComputerCraft is the beginning of this tweet. The fact that he enters it just like ComputerCraft (and that it shows adventure) strongly suggests that it's probably for CC.

Bomb Bloke #78

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 22 May 2015 - 09:35 AM

While I'm pretty sure Dan wouldn't call it a "modified version of Lau", I still reckon it boils down to "ComputerCraft without MineCraft", justifying the addition of all sorts of things that aren't practical in the MineCraft environment. The sort of things people keep asking for in the suggestions sub-forum. (… mostly because they want to be able to do them in MineCraft, true, but still…)

The fact that it's clearly made out of ComputerCraft means nothing. Surely he'd build such a thing from the solid foundation he already has? Saves a lot of time, and its users are naturally going to want to port some of their old CC scripts over. Why wouldn't he?

By the way, Dan, if you're keeping tabs on this thread - term.blit()'s pretty cool, sparks my nostalgia chip. What're the odds that this "secret project" thing will have something similar for dealing with individual pixels?

Agent Silence #79

376 posts

Location [string "FindMe"]:23143: bad argument #1 to 'returnPos' (vector expected, got nil)

Posted 22 May 2015 - 02:18 PM

Also, Dan(If you are reading this), if this is a standalone for CC, how will you implement rednet?

ebernerd #80

ebernerd's profile picture

323 posts

Location Boston, MA

Posted 25 May 2015 - 05:42 AM

I'm not sure where ( and I'm too lazy to look ) but why does everyone seem to think "standalone"? What proof is there ( again, probably is there; too lazy to look ) that makes it standalone?

Also, the text in this tweet "Never press Ctrl again!" makes me believe it's Computercraft.
https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/600685648589250561
Just a thought.

Edited on 25 May 2015 - 03:44 AM

Bomb Bloke #81

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 25 May 2015 - 08:05 AM

GLaDOS, on 25 May 2015 - 05:42 AM said:
I'm not sure where ( and I'm too lazy to look ) but why does everyone seem to think "standalone"? What proof is there ( again, probably is there; too lazy to look ) that makes it standalone?

Hard evidence? None, or it'd be stated as fact.

However, that works both ways - for example, the Ctrl thing isn't "evidence" one way or the other. It very much implies that it'll heavily be aimed at ComputerCraft users, sure, and we've seen plenty of CC's content show up in Dan's teasers, but that's far from the same thing as proving it'll be "ComputerCraft as a MineCraft mod".

On the other hand, what we do know is that Dan's been throwing in stacks of features which many users have long since assumed just aren't practical within the MineCraft environment. He's also been asking about what sort of non-MineCraft-related features coders might want; all this builds a pretty strong case for the "stand-alone" theory.

Heck, it totally wouldn't surprise me if he puts it up on Steam. He's mentioned he's going to "properly announce it" at the same time as he ships his Redirection game.

(Speaking of which, the forums over there re-e-a-a-ally need some attention.)

Does bring up an interesting question, though - would you guys pay for this? If so, how much?

Edited on 25 May 2015 - 06:08 AM

Agent Silence #82

376 posts

Location [string "FindMe"]:23143: bad argument #1 to 'returnPos' (vector expected, got nil)

Posted 25 May 2015 - 05:37 PM

Bomb Bloke, on 25 May 2015 - 08:05 AM said:
would you guys pay for this? If so, how much?

At most, for me, is about 15$
Then again, we haven't seen most of the features, so it is hard to estimate.

EDIT :
I would think that this confirms it is not a mod.
"#nextgame"

EDIT 2 :
Upon browsing more tweets…
I don't think anyone has linked to this yet.

Edited on 25 May 2015 - 03:42 PM

Creator #83

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 25 May 2015 - 06:07 PM

This topic is gaining more popularity than all my programs together.

ItsRodrick #84

95 posts

Location = gps.locate() or "unknown"

Posted 28 May 2015 - 01:23 AM

Seems IT IS CC? Tweet

Lyqyd #85

Lyqyd's profile picture

8543 posts

Posted 28 May 2015 - 01:33 AM

That tweet would indicate the exact opposite.

Dog #86

Dog's profile picture

1220 posts

Location Earth orbit

Posted 28 May 2015 - 01:34 AM

ItsRodrick, on 28 May 2015 - 01:23 AM said:
Seems IT IS CC? Tweet

Maybe I'm missing something obvious, but I don't see how that tweet infers that the secret project is related to CC.

EDIT: :ph34r:/> 'd

Edited on 27 May 2015 - 11:34 PM

Bomb Bloke #87

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 28 May 2015 - 03:05 AM

I think Rodrick is under the impression that ComputerCraftEdu is the "secret project" we've been discussing here. Really that's something different.

Dragon53535 #88

1080 posts

Location In the Matrix

Posted 28 May 2015 - 03:16 PM

Bomb Bloke, on 25 May 2015 - 08:05 AM said:
(Speaking of which, the forums over there re-e-a-a-ally need some attention.)

If you mean attention as in admin/mod attention, yeah. The entire forum is filled with bots. I was actually hoping for nice redirection creations…

ItsRodrick #89

95 posts

Location = gps.locate() or "unknown"

Posted 28 May 2015 - 05:47 PM

Oh, fine… I got a bit confused xD

3d6 #90

3d6's profile picture

350 posts

Posted 29 May 2015 - 02:40 AM

I wonder if this new game will have http support?

Assuming this isn't bring made for us, we can probably synchronize things across the two games like we do servers today!

Pyuu #91

224 posts

Posted 29 May 2015 - 03:13 PM

If this includes unicode I'mma be so happy!
However, this kind of system being implemented in CC would probably break most strings unless included in some separate API.

HDeffo #92

213 posts

Posted 29 May 2015 - 09:56 PM

Mayushii, on 29 May 2015 - 03:13 PM said:
If this includes unicode I'mma be so happy!
However, this kind of system being implemented in CC would probably break most strings unless included in some separate API.

(the following is all if it turns out to be an update to CC)

From Dan's later posts it appears to be more of a definable character maps API than a true unicode support. Either way I would assume he is going to try to maintain at least some compatibility with programs written before this eventual update. Updates "usually" try to be polite to older versions.

ebernerd #93

ebernerd's profile picture

323 posts

Location Boston, MA

Posted 04 June 2015 - 12:57 AM

"Try to be"

Not always.

And I'm so hyped. Whatever it is, tell us NOW. xD

oeed #94

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 06 June 2015 - 03:20 AM

So in light of this I got all inspired, ended up talking to awsumben13 (creator of Nova) and now we're planning to make a whole new GUI framework, and then an OS based on it.

Basically, we're waiting for Dan to release it, as until then it's rather difficult naturally. It's all very shiny and fancy, it will make the best of both worlds between the speed of Nova and the simplicity of Bedrock/OneOS. If you're so inclined, it's on GitHub here: https://github.com/oeed/Silica/

Anyway, enough banging on. The main point of this post is just to illustrate what could be possible if/when Dan adds this. These mockups are just in Photoshop, not actual screenshots obviously. I've based the screen size based on the number of pixels on the screen at the moment (i.e. the dot of the i is one pixel), but it could be different.

The text here is pretty iffy. We're adding bezier path drawing, so we'll be making vector fonts (meaning scaling :D/>), so we'll spend lots of time making sure they don't look crap.

Edited on 27 June 2015 - 05:25 AM

SquidDev #95

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 06 June 2015 - 10:47 AM

oeed, on 06 June 2015 - 03:20 AM said:
-snip-

Whoah, that does look cool - though I'm not sure about rounded corners. I must say I hadn't thought about text rendering much - I guess I better look into my Font API again. I can see something fun with Comic Sans…

TheOddByte #96

1852 posts

Location Sweden

Posted 06 June 2015 - 11:18 AM

oeed, on 06 June 2015 - 03:20 AM said:
…

That looks amazing, the text looks kind of weird, especially the "e" in "Menu", because it's just as big as the "M". :P/>

Bomb Bloke #97

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 06 June 2015 - 11:55 AM

TheOddByte, on 06 June 2015 - 11:18 AM said:
That looks amazing, the text looks kind of weird, especially the "e" in "Menu", because it's just as big as the "M". :P/>

Indeed. Either make the other lower-case characters in that set at least four pixels tall, or if you really don't want to do that, squash the "e" down flat so it's four pixels tall.

For what it's worth, once upon a time I drew up a 3x5px set, covering chars 0 to 127. Dunno if you've any interest in such a thing, but if you wanted it just let me know the format.

oeed #98

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 06 June 2015 - 03:46 PM

SquidDev, on 06 June 2015 - 10:47 AM said:
Whoah, that does look cool - though I'm not sure about rounded corners. I must say I hadn't thought about text rendering much - I guess I better look into my Font API again. I can see something fun with Comic Sans…

What is it about the rounded corners? I'm interested to know.

The biggest reason I'm using them really is just the change from the regular blocks we've been used to.

Bomb Bloke, on 06 June 2015 - 11:55 AM said:
TheOddByte, on 06 June 2015 - 11:18 AM said:
That looks amazing, the text looks kind of weird, especially the "e" in "Menu", because it's just as big as the "M". :P/>

Indeed. Either make the other lower-case characters in that set at least four pixels tall, or if you really don't want to do that, squash the "e" down flat so it's four pixels tall.

For what it's worth, once upon a time I drew up a 3x5px set, covering chars 0 to 127. Dunno if you've any interest in such a thing, but if you wanted it just let me know the format.

Yeah, text is something we're going to have to sus out.

If you've got that set it would certainly be useful!

SquidDev #99

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 06 June 2015 - 03:51 PM

oeed, on 06 June 2015 - 03:46 PM said:
SquidDev, on 06 June 2015 - 10:47 AM said:
Whoah, that does look cool - though I'm not sure about rounded corners. I must say I hadn't thought about text rendering much - I guess I better look into my Font API again. I can see something fun with Comic Sans…
What is it about the rounded corners? I'm interested to know.

Most of it looks fine, the dropdown/combo-box doesn't look great with it, but the other controls do work with it. I guess we have Microsoft to blame for the no-rounded corners style :P/>.

CrazedProgrammer #100

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 06 June 2015 - 04:37 PM

SquidDev, on 06 June 2015 - 03:51 PM said:
oeed, on 06 June 2015 - 03:46 PM said:
SquidDev, on 06 June 2015 - 10:47 AM said:
Whoah, that does look cool - though I'm not sure about rounded corners. I must say I hadn't thought about text rendering much - I guess I better look into my Font API again. I can see something fun with Comic Sans…
What is it about the rounded corners? I'm interested to know.

Most of it looks fine, the dropdown/combo-box doesn't look great with it, but the other controls do work with it. I guess we have Microsoft to blame for the no-rounded corners style :P/>.

I like the non-rounded corner style more.
Maybe because I like rectangles :P/>

Creator #101

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 06 June 2015 - 04:53 PM

CrazedProgrammer, on 06 June 2015 - 04:37 PM said:
SquidDev, on 06 June 2015 - 03:51 PM said:
oeed, on 06 June 2015 - 03:46 PM said:
SquidDev, on 06 June 2015 - 10:47 AM said:
Whoah, that does look cool - though I'm not sure about rounded corners. I must say I hadn't thought about text rendering much - I guess I better look into my Font API again. I can see something fun with Comic Sans…
What is it about the rounded corners? I'm interested to know.

Most of it looks fine, the dropdown/combo-box doesn't look great with it, but the other controls do work with it. I guess we have Microsoft to blame for the no-rounded corners style :P/>.
I like the non-rounded corner style more.
Maybe because I like rectangles :P/>

Well, maybe there can be an option in the configs.

PS: 100th post in this topic

Bomb Bloke #102

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 07 June 2015 - 02:18 AM

oeed, on 06 June 2015 - 03:46 PM said:
If you've got that set it would certainly be useful!

Edited on 10 February 2016 - 10:22 PM

oeed #103

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 07 June 2015 - 03:02 PM

Bomb Bloke, on 07 June 2015 - 02:18 AM said:
oeed, on 06 June 2015 - 03:46 PM said:
If you've got that set it would certainly be useful!

Cheers

MKlegoman357 #104

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 07 June 2015 - 03:24 PM

Keep in mind that if we will be able to manipulate each pixel individually, we will be able to use non-monospaced characters.

oeed #105

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 07 June 2015 - 03:27 PM

MKlegoman357, on 07 June 2015 - 03:24 PM said:
Keep in mind that if we will be able to manipulate each pixel individually, we will be able to use non-monospaced characters.

We're definitely planning for that. I presume Dan will still use monospaced characters though for basic CC, it does make everything far easier.

Edited on 07 June 2015 - 01:27 PM

MKlegoman357 #106

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 10 June 2015 - 08:35 PM

Didn't want to necro this post but didn't want to create a new thread for this too, so I'll just post it here.

Turtle Cameras

Maybe we'll see them in CC :P/>

Edited on 10 June 2015 - 06:35 PM

Luca_S #107

Luca_S's profile picture

477 posts

Location Germany

Posted 12 June 2015 - 09:04 PM

I would like to see more pixels, maybe you could do something like this:


local symb = term.newSymbol("# #", " # ","# #")
term.setCursorPos(1,5)
term.writeSysmbol(symb)

That will draw a symbol where # == color pixel and " " == no pixel.
It would look like this:
# #
#
# #
Forum removed the " " in the middle :/
But that all would take only 1 Space
Other idea would be that symbols wont override
so you can write anything over it to combine different colors(like this:


local symb = term.newSymbol("# #","   ","# #")
local symb2 = term.newSymbol("   "," # ","   ")
term.setCursorPos(1,5)
term.setTextColor(colors.green)
term.writeSymbol(symb)
term.setCursorPos(1,5)
term.setTextColor(colors.yellow)
term.writeSymbol(symb)
sleep(5)
term.setCursorPos(1,5)
term.clearSymbol()

)
I would love to hear your opinion on that concept :D/>

Edited on 12 June 2015 - 07:06 PM

oeed #108

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 13 June 2015 - 02:28 AM

Luca0208, on 12 June 2015 - 09:04 PM said:
- snip -
I would love to hear your opinion on that concept :D/>

Yeah, I presume Dan will have built-in support for the old term API, so being able to do that would certainly be useful.

Another screenshot again. It's not nearly as flashy as the last one though. Last night I made a few modifications to CCLite so it draws it as the current prediction has it. I'm beginning to question how accurate our guesses are given how many pixels are in this, but anyway. Here's a really basic bezier curve using Silica's new path drawing functionalities using this resolution, it's all generated by code, not Photoshop this time.

Bomb Bloke #109

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 13 June 2015 - 02:48 AM

oeed, on 13 June 2015 - 02:28 AM said:
Last night I made a few modifications to CCLite so it draws it as the current prediction has it. I'm beginning to question how accurate our guesses are given how many pixels are in this, but anyway.

It wouldn't totally surprise me if there's a term.setSize().

Geforce Fan #110

1029 posts

Location Missouri, United States, America, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way, Universe 42B, Life Street, Multiverse, 4th Dimension

Posted 13 June 2015 - 02:58 AM

This is killing me.
I've already got a huge game engine for CC, and I'm worried this will be its end.
At the same time, I'm excited for new features….
halp

LDDestroier #111

LDDestroier's profile picture

1715 posts

Location ACDC Town

Posted 13 June 2015 - 03:07 AM

Time to make Mega Man 2 with the custom terminal sizes and custom fonts. Ah who am I kidding, I can't code goodly…

Bomb Bloke #112

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 15 June 2015 - 02:15 AM

MKlegoman357, on 10 June 2015 - 08:35 PM said:
Didn't want to necro this post but didn't want to create a new thread for this too, so I'll just post it here.

Turtle Cameras

Maybe we'll see them in CC :P/>/>

It seems CCEdu will be available to all, and compatible with regular MineCraft (so long as CC is installed as well). Assuming I'm reading Dan right.

dan200 said:
Hey all! Glad to see some excitement over this. Time to lay down some info:

This is the visual programming GUI from ComputerCraftEdu, the learning/education focussed version of ComputerCraft I've been building over the last year with TeacherGaming, the developers of MinecraftEdu.

CCEdu was originally designed only for use in schools, and MinecraftEdu customers will have access to a lot of resources to help them with this, but we recently decided to make the mod available to everyone. ComputerCraftEdu will be launching next week alongside ComputerCraft 1.74.

MKlegoman357 #113

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 15 June 2015 - 06:31 AM

Yes, CCEdu will be available to everyone, but I don't think it will require CC for it to work. As I understand it's a standalone mod of CC itself, not mentioning that it's a mod in terms of MC. Some mod inception here :D/>

Lyqyd #114

Lyqyd's profile picture

8543 posts

Posted 15 June 2015 - 07:55 AM

It's a mod that can be used in addition to ComputerCraft, it isn't standalone.

Lupus590 #115

Lupus590's profile picture

2427 posts

Location UK

Posted 16 June 2015 - 11:09 AM

So CCEdu is the first (and currently only) official CC addon.

Creator #116

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 16 June 2015 - 02:37 PM

Most probably, yes!

Slash0mega #117

Slash0mega's profile picture

78 posts

Posted 27 June 2015 - 02:08 PM

holy cow this is exciting :D/>
new computercraft render or standalone, this is awesome.

Looking at all the stuff on this thread i am leaning towards some type of standalone app. perhaps a lua interpreter like the normal lua standalone. would be awesome if we could full screen it from a small linux setup and have a "real" computercraft os on a raspberry pi or something :P/>

Cranium #118

Cranium's profile picture

3790 posts

Location Lincoln, Nebraska

Posted 28 June 2015 - 12:51 AM

Slash0mega, on 27 June 2015 - 02:08 PM said:
holy cow this is exciting :D/>
new computercraft render or standalone, this is awesome.

Looking at all the stuff on this thread i am leaning towards some type of standalone app. perhaps a lua interpreter like the normal lua standalone. would be awesome if we could full screen it from a small linux setup and have a "real" computercraft os on a raspberry pi or something :P/>

It's already released in the beta section for ComputerCraft Edu.

oeed #119

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 28 June 2015 - 01:51 AM

Cranium, on 28 June 2015 - 12:51 AM said:
It's already released in the beta section for ComputerCraft Edu.

Are you sure? It doesn't seem to look like it for me. How do we use it if so?

Bomb Bloke #120

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 28 June 2015 - 02:06 AM

Slash0mega's talking about the main topic of this thread, "Dan's secret project", which will offer some new rendering options, and so far isn't available (nor does it even have an announced title, as of yet).

Another of Dan's projects discussed here, ComputerCraftEdu, is not the same thing but is already available as a beta.

Edited on 28 June 2015 - 12:08 AM

oeed #121

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 28 June 2015 - 07:13 PM

Well, much progress has been made on Silica.

Most of the core system is done. Rendering (apart from a little bug you'll see below), many views, events and, just in past 30 minutes, TEXT RENDERING :D/>

It's kinda freakishly fast, there's never really any lag at all. Bedrock runs like a turtle compared to this, and it's 50 times the amount of pixels. We probably won't be having any beta for a while, maybe once Dan releases the beta. Things like the animated progress bar are super cool, the whole thing just feels more…real.

We just got text rendering down now, it's only bitmap at this stage though. We will have vector fonts soon, but we need to sort out the path drawing issues first. Fonts are easily defined, Ben made a converter from paint to the font format, so we'll likely have a font designing app with the OS or otherwise available. They're also not monospaced too. The font below also supports characters like åéü¢ and many more. Basically all ASCII characters (although there seems to be a small issue at the moment).

Ignore the check, menu arrow and window button symbols. They're not drawing correctly at the moment. The font's also brand new, so it'll have issues and be touched up over time.

So, here's to hoping very highly that Dan does in fact release this soonish.

FUNCTION MAN! #122

FUNCTION MAN!'s profile picture

429 posts

Posted 28 June 2015 - 07:20 PM

oeed, on 28 June 2015 - 07:13 PM said:
Well, much progress has been made on Silica.

Most of the core system is done. Rendering (apart from a little bug you'll see below), many views, events and, just in past 30 minutes, TEXT RENDERING :D/>

It's kinda freakishly fast, there's never really any lag at all. Bedrock runs like a turtle compared to this, and it's 50 times the amount of pixels. We probably won't be having any beta for a while, maybe once Dan releases the beta. Things like the animated progress bar are super cool, the whole thing just feels more…real.

We just got text rendering down now, it's only bitmap at this stage though. We will have vector fonts soon, but we need to sort out the path drawing issues first. Fonts are easily defined, Ben made a converter from paint to the font format, so we'll likely have a font designing app with the OS or otherwise available. They're also not monospaced too. The font below also supports characters like åéü¢ and many more. Basically all ASCII characters (although there seems to be a small issue at the moment).

Ignore the check, menu arrow and window button symbols. They're not drawing correctly at the moment. The font's also brand new, so it'll have issues and be touched up over time.

So, here's to hoping very highly that Dan does in fact release this soonish.

Why don't you make a gitter room? it's truly a awesome chat service that allows you to have inline markdown

Creator #123

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 28 June 2015 - 07:34 PM

oeed, on 28 June 2015 - 07:13 PM said:
Well, much progress has been made on Silica.

Most of the core system is done. Rendering (apart from a little bug you'll see below), many views, events and, just in past 30 minutes, TEXT RENDERING :D/>

It's kinda freakishly fast, there's never really any lag at all. Bedrock runs like a turtle compared to this, and it's 50 times the amount of pixels. We probably won't be having any beta for a while, maybe once Dan releases the beta. Things like the animated progress bar are super cool, the whole thing just feels more…real.

We just got text rendering down now, it's only bitmap at this stage though. We will have vector fonts soon, but we need to sort out the path drawing issues first. Fonts are easily defined, Ben made a converter from paint to the font format, so we'll likely have a font designing app with the OS or otherwise available. They're also not monospaced too. The font below also supports characters like åéü¢ and many more. Basically all ASCII characters (although there seems to be a small issue at the moment).

Ignore the check, menu arrow and window button symbols. They're not drawing correctly at the moment. The font's also brand new, so it'll have issues and be touched up over time.

So, here's to hoping very highly that Dan does in fact release this soonish.

Can you show us how you modified the emulator?

oeed #124

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 29 June 2015 - 06:35 AM

Dr. Poof, on 28 June 2015 - 07:20 PM said:
Why don't you make a gitter room? it's truly a awesome chat service that allows you to have inline markdown

Done, everyone's welcome to join. https://gitter.im/oeed/Silica

Creator, on 28 June 2015 - 07:34 PM said:
Can you show us how you modified the emulator?

Basically I just got an emulator and changed the pixels sizes and number of pixels while turning of font rendering. However, I can't give it to you because we don't have permission unfortunately.

Creator #125

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 29 June 2015 - 07:51 PM

Which emulator excaclty are you using? And in which file are these settings situated?

Geforce Fan #126

1029 posts

Location Missouri, United States, America, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way, Universe 42B, Life Street, Multiverse, 4th Dimension

Posted 29 June 2015 - 09:27 PM

oeed, on 28 June 2015 - 07:13 PM said:
It's kinda freakishly fast, there's never really any lag at all. Bedrock runs like a turtle compared to this, and it's 50 times the amount of pixels. We probably won't be having any beta for a while, maybe

How is it running faster than bedrock? It surely wouldn't be able to do this in real minecraft. How have you even gotten the emulator to run this fast? I am so confused!
You are rendering everything with raw pixels, not even using text. This surely cannot be faster than the current rendering!!!

Edited on 29 June 2015 - 07:28 PM

Exerro #127

Exerro's profile picture

797 posts

Posted 29 June 2015 - 09:59 PM

We're using some really heavily optimised drawing. Not only does it only draw changes to the screen, but most elements cache their rendering unless a change is made, so, for example, the rounded corners of the button aren't re-rendered, but drawn from a cached buffer. There is some fairly noticeable lag when moving text around on the screen though, and that'll need optimising before we release it.

oeed #128

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 30 June 2015 - 03:18 AM

Creator, on 29 June 2015 - 07:51 PM said:
Which emulator excaclty are you using? And in which file are these settings situated?

CC Lite, just take a look around the code, it's fairly clear. There's discussion in the Gitter chat for how to do it.

Geforce Fan, on 29 June 2015 - 09:27 PM said:
How is it running faster than bedrock? It surely wouldn't be able to do this in real minecraft. How have you even gotten the emulator to run this fast? I am so confused!
You are rendering everything with raw pixels, not even using text. This surely cannot be faster than the current rendering!!!

Well, apart from what Ben said, Bedrock was hopelessly inefficient. I didn't really know at the time, but looking back it's no wonder it's so slow. We'll have to wait and see for how it'll run in game though.

Edited on 30 June 2015 - 01:34 AM

Creator #129

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 30 June 2015 - 03:12 PM

Can you share a link to the Gitter disscussion, because I really could not find it?

oeed #130

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 30 June 2015 - 03:26 PM

Creator, on 30 June 2015 - 03:12 PM said:
Can you share a link to the Gitter disscussion, because I really could not find it?

I've linked the Silica link in my signature to it.

SquidDev #131

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 05 July 2015 - 04:28 PM

From Dan200 on the Minecon panel:

Not a new mod but a new game but based on ComputerCraft.

So :(/>.

Edited on 05 July 2015 - 02:28 PM

MKlegoman357 #132

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 05 July 2015 - 05:49 PM

SquidDev, on 05 July 2015 - 04:28 PM said:
From Dan200 on the Minecon panel:
Not a new mod but a new game but based on ComputerCraft.

So :(/>.

Well, Dan did say at the very start that he was working on a new project that was a game. But the good part is that it is based on CC, the APIs are probably similar too so I think the new game will come along just fine :)/>

SquidDev #133

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 05 July 2015 - 05:58 PM

MKlegoman357, on 05 July 2015 - 05:49 PM said:
Well, Dan did say at the very start that he was working on a new project that was a game. But the good part is that it is based on CC, the APIs are probably similar too so I think the new game will come along just fine :)/>

I'm not that fussed as long as it is backwards compatible with CC. After all most of my projects are not Minecraft related and so would work on it. It is still going to be very, very cool.

Starup85 #134

Starup85's profile picture

4 posts

Location France

Posted 05 July 2015 - 06:08 PM

what is the date you have finished making Silica? Sorry for bad english :P/> .

Lupus590 #135

Lupus590's profile picture

2427 posts

Location UK

Posted 05 July 2015 - 07:53 PM

I wonder if he would consider adding some of the new features in the game into MC-CC (MineCraft ComputerCraft). Perhaps we could still get the pixel stuff this thread was about, just need efficient render code.

(Suggestion for dan200, open computers may have a good way, I don't actually know as I haven't looked at their source. But it's an idea, it could also help with the Lua update that has been hinted to be in the works.)

Edited on 05 July 2015 - 05:54 PM

cyanisaac #136

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385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 05 July 2015 - 08:32 PM

Honestly I don't care if this is Minecraft or not, I am in it for the programming ;)/>

jerimo #137

jerimo's profile picture

81 posts

Posted 05 July 2015 - 10:45 PM

Lupus590, on 05 July 2015 - 07:53 PM said:
I wonder if he would consider adding some of the new features in the game into MC-CC (MineCraft ComputerCraft). Perhaps we could still get the pixel stuff this thread was about, just need efficient render code.

(Suggestion for dan200, open computers may have a good way, I don't actually know as I haven't looked at their source. But it's an idea, it could also help with the Lua update that has been hinted to be in the works.)

Worst case they could also make a new peripheral with higher resolution?

oeed #138

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 06 July 2015 - 01:41 AM

SquidDev, on 05 July 2015 - 04:28 PM said:
From Dan200 on the Minecon panel:
Not a new mod but a new game but based on ComputerCraft.

So :(/>.

Was it recorded, or were you there in person?

You know, depending on what form it takes, it could be better. If it's simply running like most emulators at the moment, then to be honest I might be a little disappointed. But if it's something where you can actually go around and interact with stuff or even like Infinifactory (which Dan has been playing a lot recently), that'd be cool. It would just seem a step backward if all it was was essentially an emulator. Excited to see where it leads… and hoping to hear some more specifics *wink* *wink* *nudge* *nudge* ;)/>

Starup85, on 05 July 2015 - 06:08 PM said:
what is the date you have finished making Silica? Sorry for bad english :P/> .

Well, it probably won't be that much longer. Maybe a few weeks, but we can't give any guarantees. There is a reasonably high chance we'll release it after the OS, just so it's been heavily tested and bug free. We've been assuming for sometime that the thing that'll hold us up the most will actually be Dan releasing this, and if this new game is rather ambiguous it might be a while.

Edited on 05 July 2015 - 11:43 PM

SquidDev #139

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 06 July 2015 - 01:58 PM

oeed, on 06 July 2015 - 01:41 AM said:
Was it recorded, or were you there in person?

It was being streamed on twitch, I don't think there was a permanent recording of it though.

クデル #140

クデル's profile picture

389 posts

Posted 09 July 2015 - 01:43 PM

I can just imagine dan looking upon this thread, "heh, they think i'm going to release it".

dan200 #141

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 09 July 2015 - 02:32 PM

Status update on this thing: With ComputerCraftEdu out of the way, my current focus is on finishing the Steam release of Redirection. When that is done, this new project gets 100% of my attention :)/>

クデル #142

クデル's profile picture

389 posts

Posted 09 July 2015 - 02:35 PM

dan200, on 09 July 2015 - 02:32 PM said:
Status update on this thing: With ComputerCraftEdu out of the way, my current focus is on finishing the Steam release of Redirection. When that is done, this new project gets 100% of my attention :)/>/>

*hyperventilates*

Exerro #143

Exerro's profile picture

797 posts

Posted 09 July 2015 - 02:35 PM

You have no idea the excitement I had when I saw you had replied to this topic. Phew. Glad to know you'll be working on it soon, and I know this is a horrible question to ask that is probably un-answerable, but do you have any idea how long it'll be before a release?

oeed #144

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 09 July 2015 - 03:34 PM

All I can say is, oooooooohhhhhhhhhh yeahhhhhhh.

And there were non-believers… (I'm looking at you Bomb Bloke ;)/> )

Bomb Bloke #145

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 10 July 2015 - 12:57 AM

oeed, on 09 July 2015 - 03:34 PM said:
And there were non-believers… (I'm looking at you Bomb Bloke ;)/> )

Huh? Have you got me confused with someone else, or what are you talking about? :huh:/>

oeed #146

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 10 July 2015 - 02:32 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 10 July 2015 - 12:57 AM said:
oeed, on 09 July 2015 - 03:34 PM said:
And there were non-believers… (I'm looking at you Bomb Bloke ;)/> )

Huh? Have you got me confused with someone else, or what are you talking about? :huh:/>

Bomb Bloke, on 24 June 2015 - 02:05 AM said:
oeed, on 24 June 2015 - 01:40 AM said:
So having full pixels is basically a must if it does get added, which seems increasingly unlikely.

Fixed that for you. :)/>

Lyqyd #147

Lyqyd's profile picture

8543 posts

Posted 10 July 2015 - 04:11 AM

Take a look at the context–that was in reference to the idea that this project was a change or new functionality to ComputerCraft as a Minecraft mod, which it is not. Bomb Bloke was referring to it seeming increasingly unlikely that this project was meant for the Minecraft mod, and he was right.

oeed #148

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 10 July 2015 - 04:18 AM

Lyqyd, on 10 July 2015 - 04:11 AM said:
Take a look at the context–that was in reference to the idea that this project was a change or new functionality to ComputerCraft as a Minecraft mod, which it is not. Bomb Bloke was referring to it seeming increasingly unlikely that this project was meant for the Minecraft mod, and he was right.

Hmm yeah okay I guess you're right there. It's just how I perceived it guess.

クデル #149

クデル's profile picture

389 posts

Posted 10 July 2015 - 04:29 AM

Lyqyd, on 10 July 2015 - 04:11 AM said:
Take a look at the context–that was in reference to the idea that this project was a change or new functionality to ComputerCraft as a Minecraft mod, which it is not. Bomb Bloke was referring to it seeming increasingly unlikely that this project was meant for the Minecraft mod, and he was right.

Try to put an emoji in more often, makes you appear more friendly. :D/>

Cranium #150

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3790 posts

Location Lincoln, Nebraska

Posted 10 July 2015 - 04:14 PM

Ice Cream, on 10 July 2015 - 04:29 AM said:
Try to put an emoji in more often, makes you appear more friendly. :D/>

Or not, because they are often extraneous and not at all within the tone of the conversation?

Edited on 10 July 2015 - 02:14 PM

クデル #151

クデル's profile picture

389 posts

Posted 12 July 2015 - 02:00 PM

Cranium, on 10 July 2015 - 04:14 PM said:
Ice Cream, on 10 July 2015 - 04:29 AM said:
Try to put an emoji in more often, makes you appear more friendly. :D/>/>
Or not, because they are often extraneous and not at all within the tone of the conversation?

That's your opinion, as my original post is mine.

TheOddByte #152

1852 posts

Location Sweden

Posted 13 July 2015 - 12:12 AM

Ice Cream, on 10 July 2015 - 04:29 AM said:
Try to put an emoji in more often, makes you appear more friendly. :D/>

What are you saying? That Lyqyd doesn't seem friendly, he seems friendly to me :P/>
On a more serious note, he's friendly, but he keeps a more professional profile so-to say.

dan200, on 09 July 2015 - 02:32 PM said:
Status update on this thing: With ComputerCraftEdu out of the way, my current focus is on finishing the Steam release of Redirection. When that is done, this new project gets 100% of my attention :)/>

On topic, this makes me happy, I'm excited to see what you have in store for us.
Please tell me you need beta-testers for your secret project, as I'd love to beta-test it.

Waitdev_ #153

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 13 July 2015 - 05:52 AM

yea. you need beta testers.
and yea. i'm saying that cause i want to know what it is :)/>

lelelelelelelelelel

cyanisaac #154

cyanisaac's profile picture

385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 13 July 2015 - 10:26 PM

I am so excited to see what I can make for this. It looks just so damn cool.

SnappComputerCraft #155

SnappComputerCraft's profile picture

22 posts

Posted 26 July 2015 - 06:24 AM

I'm mostly excited for Silica. If I ever master Lua, I am going to make an operating system with it. And if my stubbornness gets the better of me, I might try to 1-Up you. Just a warning.

SnappComputerCraft #156

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22 posts

Posted 26 July 2015 - 06:36 AM

Creator, on 20 May 2015 - 06:18 PM said:
If what you are saying is true, then not only would Dan slowly replace GabeN as our Lord, but also itwill be the best mod ever. And the internet will explode since it won't be able to handle the awesomeness of Dan and ComputerCraft.

I know I just got into this topic, but I have one thing: GabeN is not my Lord. God is. Unless you're talking about gaming in which case… Todd Howard :3

Creator #157

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 26 July 2015 - 04:29 PM

Of course I am talking about gaming. Else I would mention the flying spaghetti monster.

Just joking. Please don't start a religious debate. :P/>

Edited on 26 July 2015 - 02:29 PM

oeed #158

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 26 July 2015 - 11:21 PM

SnappComputerCraft, on 26 July 2015 - 06:24 AM said:
I'm mostly excited for Silica. If I ever master Lua, I am going to make an operating system with it. And if my stubbornness gets the better of me, I might try to 1-Up you. Just a warning.

Well if you want you can basically get started now, the docs are currently being written with a few pages online already.

Waitdev_ #159

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 31 July 2015 - 03:33 PM

i'm starting to find it funny how this was supposed to be around a secret project from dan200, but oeed comes in with silica adding a whole new topic to this.

MKlegoman357 #160

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 31 July 2015 - 05:10 PM

Well, it's the 'closest thing' for us to 'see' Dan's secret project.

oeed #161

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 01 August 2015 - 02:39 AM

Well, yeah status update on Silica.

Basically we're waiting for Dan now really. Once we get some more confirmation on it we'll continue, because most of it is actually ready now.

If you haven't looked at it yet you can check it out in a bundled up .love file here (you'll need to install love2d though): http://puu.sh/jiEi4/23725f2776.love

LeDark Lua #162

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 01 August 2015 - 01:42 PM

I hope Dan will release Sounds and More Colors. sounds as beeps. That would be cool.

Waitdev_ #163

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818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 02 August 2015 - 02:27 AM

LeDark Lua, on 01 August 2015 - 01:42 PM said:
I hope Dan will release Sounds and More Colors. sounds as beeps. That would be cool.

32-colors ftw

クデル #164

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389 posts

Posted 02 August 2015 - 03:27 AM

I hope dan adds a Watch Computer :P/>

Waitdev_ #165

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818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 02 August 2015 - 03:58 AM

hmm… in 1.9, they are adding dual wielding.
that means, we could put a pda in the left spot and use it as a watch :)/>

HPWebcamAble #166

957 posts

Location Web Development

Posted 02 August 2015 - 06:11 AM

Wait_, on 02 August 2015 - 03:58 AM said:
in 1.9, they are adding dual wielding…we could put a pda in the left spot and use it as a watch :)/>

That would be cool!

Though I wouldn't hold your breath. CC isn't even out for 1.8 yet, and its been around a year.

MKlegoman357 #167

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 02 August 2015 - 10:25 AM

Based on the modding panel in Minecon 2015 I'd say there will be no CC for MC 1.8, but rather for 1.9.

Edited on 02 August 2015 - 08:25 AM

Waitdev_ #168

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 05 August 2015 - 11:30 AM

MKlegoman357, on 02 August 2015 - 10:25 AM said:
Based on the modding panel in Minecon 2015 I'd say there will be no CC for MC 1.8, but rather for 1.9.

well, that makes it a lot more perfect.

cyanisaac #169

cyanisaac's profile picture

385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 25 August 2015 - 01:29 AM

I wish Dan would give us some information about the project. For instance can it run CC code? What resolution is it? What colors does it support?

Such information would be great so we could start creating stuff to support it before it launches.

oeed #170

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 25 August 2015 - 01:32 AM

cyanisaac, on 25 August 2015 - 01:29 AM said:
I wish Dan would give us some information about the project. For instance can it run CC code? What resolution is it? What colors does it support?

Such information would be great so we could start creating stuff to support it before it launches.

I did tweet him about yesterday, but he hasn't replied to it yet. https://twitter.com/oeed_/status/635785716044296192

Our PM about Silica is still sitting in his inbox from a month ago (a month today in fact), he hasn't been on the forums in over a month.

He is working on Redirection though, and having been in the same situation many times before I can understand we he isn't being overly communicative.

Bomb Bloke #171

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 26 August 2015 - 11:29 AM

cyanisaac, on 25 August 2015 - 01:29 AM said:
I wish Dan would give us some information about the project. For instance can it run CC code? What resolution is it? What colors does it support?

Such information would be great so we could start creating stuff to support it before it launches.

At this stage, answer to these questions are irrelevant. Even if he provided details about "how things are at the moment", it's entirely possible that he'd want to change them at some point before release.

Creeper9207 #172

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224 posts

Posted 15 September 2015 - 11:51 PM

Here's something i've been thinking about, if the resolution is similar to what silica portrays it as, then it seems like a 3d engine would be possible (similar to the super FX chip in the snes)

CrazedProgrammer #173

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 16 September 2015 - 08:11 AM

Creeper9207, on 15 September 2015 - 11:51 PM said:
Here's something i've been thinking about, if the resolution is similar to what silica portrays it as, then it seems like a 3d engine would be possible (similar to the super FX chip in the snes)

A 3D engine is already possible.

LeDark Lua #174

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 16 September 2015 - 01:03 PM

But a 3D engine with color depth is not. If Dan could release 16bit or 8bit That would be awesome.

Creeper9207 #175

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 17 September 2015 - 02:16 AM

Just imagine…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pmcbq5Iqgw

MKlegoman357 #176

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 25 September 2015 - 05:05 PM

New GIF!

EDIT: Unix time format? Modular computer parts? Real life CC-inspired operating system?? :D/>

Edited on 25 September 2015 - 03:07 PM

FUNCTION MAN! #177

FUNCTION MAN!'s profile picture

429 posts

Posted 25 September 2015 - 05:50 PM

Where do you see Unix time format? Is that layman-speak for time_t? Then no, that isn't time_t. That isn't a real life OS either.

MKlegoman357 #178

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 25 September 2015 - 08:43 PM

Dr. Poof, on 25 September 2015 - 05:50 PM said:
Where do you see Unix time format? Is that layman-speak for time_t? Then no, that isn't time_t. That isn't a real life OS either.

Just look at the date, it's the same date that Unix time uses as the starting point. Also, why do you think I'd be talking about time_t datatype? I was trying to point out that the system the Lua scripts are being run in might be able to fetch time in Unix time format. Also, I don't think it's a real life OS either..

Edited on 25 September 2015 - 06:43 PM

FUNCTION MAN! #179

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429 posts

Posted 26 September 2015 - 01:02 AM

MKlegoman357, on 25 September 2015 - 08:43 PM said:
Dr. Poof, on 25 September 2015 - 05:50 PM said:
Where do you see Unix time format? Is that layman-speak for time_t? Then no, that isn't time_t. That isn't a real life OS either.

Just look at the date, it's the same date that Unix time uses as the starting point. Also, why do you think I'd be talking about time_t datatype? I was trying to point out that the system the Lua scripts are being run in might be able to fetch time in Unix time format. Also, I don't think it's a real life OS either..

Sure, it's the unix epoch. But not the unix time format - that's signed time_t.

Waitdev_ #180

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 26 September 2015 - 01:05 AM

well, atleast the gif is intresting.

oeed #181

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 26 September 2015 - 02:33 AM

MKlegoman357, on 25 September 2015 - 05:05 PM said:
New GIF!

EDIT: Unix time format? Modular computer parts? Real life CC-inspired operating system?? :D/>

Awwww yeah

Agent Silence #182

376 posts

Location [string "FindMe"]:23143: bad argument #1 to 'returnPos' (vector expected, got nil)

Posted 26 September 2015 - 03:43 PM

This gets better by the minute

Creator #183

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 26 September 2015 - 05:33 PM

That GIF sure is nice!

gollark8 #184

208 posts

Posted 26 September 2015 - 05:46 PM

It seems oddly like OpenComputers.

MKlegoman357 #185

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 30 September 2015 - 03:19 PM

Not saying that it is the same project, but this does look familiar.

oeed #186

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 01 October 2015 - 01:24 AM

MKlegoman357, on 30 September 2015 - 03:19 PM said:
Not saying that it is the same project, but this does look familiar.

It's hard to tell whether he's trolling us to pieces with a massive red herring or it's actually a real standalone framework.

I can't tell which one I'd like more though to be honest, standalone would be awesome as long as we can also run on OS X/Windows/etc. too. Presumably this means it'll be much faster too.

クデル #187

クデル's profile picture

389 posts

Posted 01 October 2015 - 11:26 AM

There's a lot of effort and thought gone into this, considering the amount Dan's released in regards to "leaks" which may potentially unrelated. For all we know he was just playing around in a modified emulator, and enjoying random lines.

For all we know, Dan is apart of Hydra and once this thread meets an acceptable level of hype, kaboom. RIP Oceania.

Edited on 01 October 2015 - 09:26 AM

Creator #188

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 01 October 2015 - 07:20 PM

Or he is laughing himself to death right now seeing how w are trying to guess what he is doing.

LeDark Lua #189

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 01 October 2015 - 07:24 PM

Creator, on 01 October 2015 - 07:20 PM said:
Or he is laughing himself to death right now seeing how w are trying to guess what he is doing.

Hmmmm, I think its true…

oeed #190

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 02 October 2015 - 01:20 AM

That said, his account hasn't been on the forums since July. So unless he's made another account, which seems a little crazy, it's probably less likely. Although, that said he could just read without logging in… didn't think of that actually.

Waitdev_ #191

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 02 October 2015 - 01:30 AM

or, just sign in anonymously.

CraftedCart #192

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 03 October 2015 - 08:19 PM

"Approaching Usability" :D/>
Also scroll bars and underlining, and a quit button in the top right
https://twitter.com/...360669833986048

Edited on 03 October 2015 - 06:21 PM

MKlegoman357 #193

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 03 October 2015 - 08:35 PM

".lml" - Lua Markup Language? Looks very interesting.

CraftedCart #194

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 03 October 2015 - 08:41 PM

MKlegoman357, on 03 October 2015 - 08:35 PM said:
".lml" - Lua Markup Language? Looks very interesting.

I didn't know that stood for that, I just assumed Dan made up an extention

MKlegoman357 #195

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 03 October 2015 - 09:12 PM

CraftedCart, on 03 October 2015 - 08:41 PM said:
I didn't know that stood for that, I just assumed Dan made up an extention

I'm just speculating here :lol:/>

oeed #196

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 04 October 2015 - 01:47 AM

Well then.

That's very promising for Silica. As we'd hoped, it's not just a font. Time to figure out this screen size…

Based on some slightly iffy measuring in Photoshop (the image was scaled so pixels weren't clearly defined) I believe the screen resolution is 280 x 175. We guessed 310 x 175 for Silica, so looking good so far.

Edited on 04 October 2015 - 12:00 AM

Bomb Bloke #197

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 04 October 2015 - 03:50 AM

oeed, on 04 October 2015 - 01:47 AM said:
Based on some slightly iffy measuring in Photoshop (the image was scaled so pixels weren't clearly defined) I believe the screen resolution is 280 x 175. We guessed 310 x 175 for Silica, so looking good so far.

Assuming you're talking about this image, the characters are 8x8, so the original would've either been 320x200 or some scale of that.

Who knows, might even be good ol' mode 13h!

oeed #198

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 04 October 2015 - 04:03 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 04 October 2015 - 03:50 AM said:
oeed, on 04 October 2015 - 01:47 AM said:
Based on some slightly iffy measuring in Photoshop (the image was scaled so pixels weren't clearly defined) I believe the screen resolution is 280 x 175. We guessed 310 x 175 for Silica, so looking good so far.

Assuming you're talking about this image, the characters are 8x8, so the original would've either been 320x200 or some scale of that.

Who knows, might even be good ol' mode 13h!

Mmmmm, I count 7 x 7.

Also, he's at least pointing to this not being Minecraft.

He also doesn't seem entirely sure what this is himself. May he could get some community input ;)/> *wink* *wink* *nudge* *nudge*

So yeah, Dan, if you are reading this, here are my ideas.

Making it standalone like that R-Pi screenshot somewhat suggested would be very, very useful for many people and cases, provided that you also had an identical desktop version. That's certainly a big project, but you're giving people the next step to expand their coding knowledge from beyond an emulator to quite literally a fully fledged operating system. Removing the unnecessarily complicated backend stuff of low-level coding and providing the simple front end APIs (maybe with a little more complexity) from ComputerCraft to basically make real world ComputerCraft computers would be pretty damn cool.

Edited on 04 October 2015 - 02:14 AM

Bomb Bloke #199

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 04 October 2015 - 04:27 AM

oeed, on 04 October 2015 - 04:03 AM said:
Mmmmm, I count 7 x 7.

Nah.

oeed, on 04 October 2015 - 04:03 AM said:
Also, he's at least pointing to this not being Minecraft.

… it's a screenshot referencing CraftOS… an OS that's from a certain Minecraft mod, and named after Minecraft itself.

Come on, Dan, if a picture is worth a thousand words, then you know full well what you're "saying" with them. ;)/>

Edited on 10 February 2016 - 10:24 PM

oeed #200

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 04 October 2015 - 04:30 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 04 October 2015 - 04:27 AM said:
Nah.

Huh, well there you go, more pixels for us then!

Creator #201

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 04 October 2015 - 08:46 AM

This is so cool. Maybe he'll be releasing it soon, because that would motivate me to code again.

FUNCTION MAN! #202

FUNCTION MAN!'s profile picture

429 posts

Posted 04 October 2015 - 04:58 PM

If you need motivation, you ain't doing it right.

Creator #203

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 04 October 2015 - 05:12 PM

Then how, expert?

FUNCTION MAN! #204

FUNCTION MAN!'s profile picture

429 posts

Posted 04 October 2015 - 06:40 PM

Find an interesting project, open vim, get coding.

Geforce Fan #205

1029 posts

Location Missouri, United States, America, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way, Universe 42B, Life Street, Multiverse, 4th Dimension

Posted 04 October 2015 - 07:13 PM

DemHydraz, on 04 October 2015 - 06:40 PM said:
Find an interesting project, open vim, get coding.

While the vim part is certainly accurate, you really do need motivation to code.

CraftedCart #206

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 04 October 2015 - 07:24 PM

Geforce Fan, on 04 October 2015 - 07:13 PM said:
DemHydraz, on 04 October 2015 - 06:40 PM said:
Find an interesting project, open vim, get coding.
While the vim part is certainly accurate, you really do need motivation to code.

JUST DO IT!
(Sorry)

FUNCTION MAN! #207

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429 posts

Posted 04 October 2015 - 07:34 PM

DON'T LET YOUR MEMES BE DREAMS!

JUST!
DO!
IT!

Edited on 04 October 2015 - 05:34 PM

CraftedCart #208

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 04 October 2015 - 08:07 PM

If doesn't help you get motivated, IDK what will
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-sfG8BV8wU

Waitdev_ #209

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818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 06 October 2015 - 05:57 AM

YAY!
https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/651155929065369600

Bomb Bloke #210

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 06 October 2015 - 07:57 AM

By now I'm hoping it gets released under the name "secret project".

CraftedCart #211

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 06 October 2015 - 07:57 AM

Ooh, fancy

oeed #212

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 06 October 2015 - 07:59 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 06 October 2015 - 07:57 AM said:
By now I'm hoping it gets released under the name "secret project".

Ditto :P/>

Creator #213

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 06 October 2015 - 09:24 AM

This gets more and more interesting by the day.

Xenthera #214

167 posts

Posted 07 October 2015 - 01:12 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 04 October 2015 - 03:50 AM said:
Assuming you're talking about this image, the characters are 8x8, so the original would've either been 320x200 or some scale of that.

Who knows, might even be good ol' mode 13h!

I would like to believe it's 320 x 180. That way we would get a nice 16:9 ratio, and have perfectly square pixels on modern displays connected to a raspberry pi. (hint hint)
Here's to speculating though.

Edited on 06 October 2015 - 11:24 PM

oeed #215

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 07 October 2015 - 02:39 AM

Xenthera, on 07 October 2015 - 01:12 AM said:
Bomb Bloke, on 04 October 2015 - 03:50 AM said:
Assuming you're talking about this image, the characters are 8x8, so the original would've either been 320x200 or some scale of that.

Who knows, might even be good ol' mode 13h!

I would like to believe it's 320 x 180. That way we would get a nice 16:9 ratio, and have perfectly square pixels on modern displays connected to a raspberry pi. (hint hint)
Here's to speculating though.

Yeah, the slightly larger screen is nice.

What I'm hoping for though is a (at least slightly) large colour palette. If this isn't in Minecraft it doesn't make sense to just use the Minecraft colours. Ben and I are looking at more realistic drop shadows (similar to Google's Material design) and that just ain't happening on a 16 colour system.

Edited on 07 October 2015 - 02:22 PM

Waitdev_ #216

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818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 07 October 2015 - 02:41 AM

i would like at least 32 colours, but 64 or 256 would be great.
it would be nice to have gradients and coloured fades.

edit: and better paint, it would be cool to see what nitrogenfingers can do ;)/>
*wink wink* *nudge nudge*

Edited on 07 October 2015 - 12:42 AM

Creator #217

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 07 October 2015 - 05:24 AM

Nope, only 256^3 colors is enough.

Bomb Bloke #218

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 07 October 2015 - 05:51 AM

Don't forget this old post - it has an extra shade of grey compared to ComputerCraft.

CraftedCart #219

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 07 October 2015 - 07:30 AM

Creator, on 07 October 2015 - 05:24 AM said:
Nope, only 256^3 colors is enough.

Indeed

There us one thing that hasn't been mentioned yet. Sounds…

oeed #220

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 07 October 2015 - 07:33 AM

CraftedCart, on 07 October 2015 - 07:30 AM said:
Creator, on 07 October 2015 - 05:24 AM said:
Nope, only 256^3 colors is enough.

Indeed

There us one thing that hasn't been mentioned yet. Sounds…

This hints at it, although something tells me that's just a bunch of prints and sleeps. It's probably an indication as to what's to come though.

Edited on 07 October 2015 - 05:36 AM

SquidDev #221

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 07 October 2015 - 04:08 PM

oeed, on 07 October 2015 - 02:39 AM said:
What I'm hoping for though is a (at least slightly) large colour palette. If this isn't in Minecraft it doesn't make sense to just use the Minecraft colours. Ben and I are looking and more realistic drop shadows (similar to Google's Material design) and that just ain't happening on a 16 colour system.

Do not fear! RGB here we come!

oeed #222

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 07 October 2015 - 04:16 PM

SquidDev, on 07 October 2015 - 04:08 PM said:
oeed, on 07 October 2015 - 02:39 AM said:
What I'm hoping for though is a (at least slightly) large colour palette. If this isn't in Minecraft it doesn't make sense to just use the Minecraft colours. Ben and I are looking and more realistic drop shadows (similar to Google's Material design) and that just ain't happening on a 16 colour system.

Do not fear! RGB here we come!

Oh mm….y g…..g…ggg

ff…f..fff…ffff……

IT'S A CHRISTMAS MIRACLE!

Anyway, as it seems a little too coincidental for Dan not to be reading this, thanks Dan!

Here's to hoping that it's not just changing colour value of the 16 colours though (as in making the white more grey, rather than being able to display more than just 16 colours).

Creator #223

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 07 October 2015 - 04:47 PM

Why would you need to change the palette when you've got 256^3 colors.

SquidDev #224

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1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 07 October 2015 - 04:50 PM

oeed, on 07 October 2015 - 04:16 PM said:
Here's to hoping that it's not just changing colour value of the 16 colours though (as in making the white more grey, rather than being able to display more than just 16 colours).

Hadn't thought of that. Dan did mention he might so maybe? I can see Dan is reading this so please? Pretty please. :)/>

LeDark Lua #225

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 07 October 2015 - 05:01 PM

OMG, what I dont get is it a OperatingSystem, or more like a kernel that we can build a OS on top or more like DOS. Anyways if this project is a program its still great ( I should include: awesome, mind-blowingly AWESOME ).

oeed #226

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 07 October 2015 - 05:03 PM

LeDark Lua, on 07 October 2015 - 05:01 PM said:
OMG, what I dont get is it a OperatingSystem, or more like a kernel that we can build a OS on top or more like DOS. Anyways if this project is a program its still great ( I should include: awesome, mind-blowingly AWESOME ).

Whaa..?

It's not a program for CC, it's kinda like a brand new CC.

FUNCTION MAN! #227

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429 posts

Posted 07 October 2015 - 08:08 PM

I think he mean an actual OS.

LeDark Lua #228

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 07 October 2015 - 08:33 PM

Yeah I should said: Not Talking About Regular CC. :D/> Sorry :D/>

Edited on 07 October 2015 - 06:33 PM

Wojbie #229

724 posts

Location Kinda lost

Posted 07 October 2015 - 08:47 PM

oeed, on 07 October 2015 - 05:03 PM said:
It's not a program for CC, it's kinda like a brand new CC.

I just had silly idea. CC framework that people could use to place CC into any mod for any game? CC in Garry'sMod, CC in Fallout 4.
Not very likely but as unlikely as CCv2.

CraftedCart #230

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 07 October 2015 - 08:50 PM

oeed, on 07 October 2015 - 04:16 PM said:
SquidDev, on 07 October 2015 - 04:08 PM said:
oeed, on 07 October 2015 - 02:39 AM said:
What I'm hoping for though is a (at least slightly) large colour palette. If this isn't in Minecraft it doesn't make sense to just use the Minecraft colours. Ben and I are looking and more realistic drop shadows (similar to Google's Material design) and that just ain't happening on a 16 colour system.

Do not fear! RGB here we come!

Oh mm….y g…..g…ggg

ff…f..fff…ffff……

IT'S A CHRISTMAS MIRACLE!

Anyway, as it seems a little too coincidental for Dan not to be reading this, thanks Dan!

Here's to hoping that it's not just changing colour value of the 16 colours though (as in making the white more grey, rather than being able to display more than just 16 colours).

Nope. We're still restricted to 16 colours

https://twitter.com/dantwohundred/status/651846379485196288

Creator #231

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 07 October 2015 - 08:55 PM

Hope he is joking.

FUNCTION MAN! #232

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429 posts

Posted 07 October 2015 - 08:56 PM

But it is enough to anybody, why would you need more than 16 colors?

CraftedCart #233

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 07 October 2015 - 08:58 PM

DemHydraz, on 07 October 2015 - 08:56 PM said:
But it is enough to anybody, why would you need more than 16 colors?

For gradients and transparency effects

Edited on 07 October 2015 - 07:02 PM

Creator #234

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 07 October 2015 - 09:41 PM

CraftedCart, on 07 October 2015 - 08:58 PM said:
DemHydraz, on 07 October 2015 - 08:56 PM said:
But it is enough to anybody, why would you need more than 16 colors?

For gradients and transparency effects

Exactly!

FUNCTION MAN! #235

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429 posts

Posted 07 October 2015 - 10:45 PM

CraftedCart, on 07 October 2015 - 08:58 PM said:
DemHydraz, on 07 October 2015 - 08:56 PM said:
But it is enough to anybody, why would you need more than 16 colors?

For gradients and transparency effects

What's a transparency? I use terminals

dan200 #236

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 07 October 2015 - 11:20 PM

Uncharacteristically chiming in to say: There's a whole era of computers which did amazing things with 16 colour displays. Look up DOS EGA games some time, or the Spectrum, or the Commodore, or the Apple 2, or the BBC Micro, etc… and they didn't have reprogrammable palettes. CC has always been inspired by this era of retrocomputing.

FUNCTION MAN! #237

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429 posts

Posted 07 October 2015 - 11:50 PM

Yet, Lua.

dan200 #238

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 07 October 2015 - 11:54 PM

Which was chosen primarilly for it's simplicity and ease of use, much like BASIC on most of those systems.

HPWebcamAble #239

957 posts

Location Web Development

Posted 08 October 2015 - 01:58 AM

wojbie, on 07 October 2015 - 08:47 PM said:
…Not very likely but as unlikely as CCv2.

Plot twist: The secret project is CC2

Yes, its really unlikely, since those gifs seem to show something too advanced for minecraft, but hey, maybe dan'll surprise us ;)/>

oeed #240

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2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 08 October 2015 - 02:03 AM

dan200, on 07 October 2015 - 11:20 PM said:
Uncharacteristically chiming in to say: There's a whole era of computers which did amazing things with 16 colour displays. Look up DOS EGA games some time, or the Spectrum, or the Commodore, or the Apple 2, or the BBC Micro, etc… and they didn't have reprogrammable palettes. CC has always been inspired by this era of retrocomputing.

Oh yeah, I agree, but now that we're moving forward to smaller pixels, it's kinda like jumping forward a decade to a time with a few more colours ;)/>

Anyway, I can't say I entirely agree with your choice, but hey, it's your project and it might still be the best choice for simplicity, which is certainly an important aspect.

dan200 #241

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 08 October 2015 - 02:11 AM

oeed, on 08 October 2015 - 02:03 AM said:
dan200, on 07 October 2015 - 11:20 PM said:
Uncharacteristically chiming in to say: There's a whole era of computers which did amazing things with 16 colour displays. Look up DOS EGA games some time, or the Spectrum, or the Commodore, or the Apple 2, or the BBC Micro, etc… and they didn't have reprogrammable palettes. CC has always been inspired by this era of retrocomputing.

Oh yeah, I agree, but now that we're moving forward to smaller pixels, it's kinda like jumping forward a decade to a time with a few more colours ;)/>

Anyway, I can't say I entirely agree with your choice, but hey, it's your project and it might still be the best choice for simplicity, which is certainly an important aspect.

The current display specs exactly match a common display standard circa about 1990 (not saying there won't be different tiers of displays eventually though). The era i'm emulating has some truly beautiful pixel art games, and I'd like to encourage people to reproduce some of that before jumping straight to gradients, blending etc. Limitations often breed creativity.

dan200 #242

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 08 October 2015 - 02:26 AM

Anyway, back to being mysterious…

oeed #243

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Posted 08 October 2015 - 03:30 AM

dan200, on 08 October 2015 - 02:11 AM said:
The current display specs exactly match a common display standard circa about 1990 (not saying there won't be different tiers of displays eventually though). The era i'm emulating has some truly beautiful pixel art games, and I'd like to encourage people to reproduce some of that before jumping straight to gradients, blending etc. Limitations often breed creativity.

Oh yeah, I completely agree, although we've already done that really. But hey, let's wait and see.

Creator #244

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 08 October 2015 - 05:31 AM

dan200, on 08 October 2015 - 02:26 AM said:
Anyway, back to being mysterious…

Why? Can't you go back to revealing your secret?

oeed #245

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2151 posts

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Posted 08 October 2015 - 05:33 AM

Creator, on 08 October 2015 - 05:31 AM said:
dan200, on 08 October 2015 - 02:26 AM said:
Anyway, back to being mysterious…

Why? Can't you go back to revealing your secret?

Well there isn't much we don't already know at this point. Dan doesn't even seem completely sure what it will be yet, we'll have to just watch and wait to see what happens.

CraftedCart #246

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 08 October 2015 - 06:42 AM

dan200, on 07 October 2015 - 11:20 PM said:
Limitations often breed creativity.

Alright, fair enough. I'd agree with you there

Agent Silence #247

376 posts

Location [string "FindMe"]:23143: bad argument #1 to 'returnPos' (vector expected, got nil)

Posted 08 October 2015 - 04:34 PM

Creator, on 08 October 2015 - 05:31 AM said:
dan200, on 08 October 2015 - 02:26 AM said:
Anyway, back to being mysterious…

Why? Can't you go back to revealing your secret?

A code magician never reveals his secrets.

Creator #248

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 08 October 2015 - 04:42 PM

Agent Silence, on 08 October 2015 - 04:34 PM said:
Creator, on 08 October 2015 - 05:31 AM said:
dan200, on 08 October 2015 - 02:26 AM said:
Anyway, back to being mysterious…

Why? Can't you go back to revealing your secret?
A code magician never reveals his secrets.

Yup, you just decompile the code. That way he doesn't have to say a word.

Xenthera #249

167 posts

Posted 08 October 2015 - 05:09 PM

dan200, on 08 October 2015 - 02:11 AM said:
The current display specs exactly match a common display standard circa about 1990 (not saying there won't be different tiers of displays eventually though). The era i'm emulating has some truly beautiful pixel art games, and I'd like to encourage people to reproduce some of that before jumping straight to gradients, blending etc. Limitations often breed creativity.

I know everyone including dan has been talking/hinting about this not being another minecraft mod, but having different tier displays on anything but, wouldn't really make any sense.
Personally I would like to see something on the raspberry pi, but just in case this happens to be minecraft related, i've already made something similar for my raspberry pi 2 with cython and lua bindings.
I'll leave that to your imagination though as I don't want to advert anything on dan's forums.

Edited on 08 October 2015 - 04:29 PM

Bomb Bloke #250

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Posted 08 October 2015 - 10:50 PM

Xenthera, on 08 October 2015 - 05:09 PM said:
I know everyone including dan has been talking/hinting about this not being another minecraft mod, but having different tier displays on anything but, wouldn't really make any sense.

There are quite a few possibilities as to how it could fit. One of the simpler ones is to think in terms of display modes, which could be changed with a function call - eg.

Back in the day, even if your system supported a decent colour depth, that didn't mean it had enough display memory to implement it alongside a decent screen resolution. And if you wanted to take advantage of display pages (buffers stored in VRAM), then you typically had to cut down on both.

FUNCTION MAN! #251

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429 posts

Posted 08 October 2015 - 11:02 PM

eg. VESA Modes. They still exist.

oeed #252

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2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 09 October 2015 - 10:21 AM

Well the way I see it is, if you want to make it simple and intuitive it'd be a bit silly to have different display options for the sake of it. Stick to one, and if that means 16 colours then so be it.

Creator #253

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 09 October 2015 - 12:08 PM

In one of the gifs he showed a palette editor. What is that? ☺

Bomb Bloke #254

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 09 October 2015 - 01:42 PM

Er, what? Is that some sort of rhetorical question?

I feel like you're making some sort of joke rather than asking for an actual explanation; but I can't tell what the punchline might be. :unsure:/>

Edited on 09 October 2015 - 11:43 AM

apemanzilla #255

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1610 posts

Posted 09 October 2015 - 01:43 PM

Creator, on 09 October 2015 - 12:08 PM said:
In one of the gifs he showed a palette editor. What is that? ☺

There was a suggestion a while ago about keeping the same 16 color system, but allowing those colors to be changed. So one could change blue to be a lighter shade - it would then replace the blue color. This way you wouldn't need to send more packets for different colors, just one packet to tell the client what the color "bindings" are.

oeed #256

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 09 October 2015 - 02:11 PM

I'm still in two minds about this 16 colour palette. The benefit isn't really that big to be honest, all the colours we've got cover all the basic colours we need. Still limited to just 16 colours, being able to change them won't have that much of an effect. Just, ehhh

Annnyway… mmm.

Ben and I have some ideas for something like this… Put it this way, Dan you might have some competition ;)/>

Creator #257

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 09 October 2015 - 02:16 PM

No, I'm completely serious. He showed a gif with a palette editor. What is a palette?

Bomb Bloke #258

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 09 October 2015 - 02:34 PM

It's the MS Paint icon.

Say you're dedicating four bits of memory for every pixel on your display. That allows you to store a fair number of pixels in RAM, but the catch is that four bits only offers 16 combinations per pixel. You can't really define any decent colours with such a small range.

So, you define a separate array which holds your actual colours. Here you use a decent number of bits per value - say 24 - allowing a much larger range of combinations. By using your pixel data as indexes into this array, you've greatly expanded the number of colours you can put on the screen, while still only dedicating four bits per pixel (plus an extra bit of memory for your array of colours - your palette).

ComputerCraft uses four bits for the text colour of a given character, and four bits for the background colour of a given character - eight bits in total. These two values index into a 16 colour palette, which we can't change.

A palette editor makes it possible to use a great deal more colours than is possible within ComputerCraft (somewhere around 16mill, in the case of Dan's 24 bit implementation). Catch is, you can still only use 16 unique colours at a time - as that's the size of the palette.

Back in the day, animations were often produced by drawing a static image, and then simply changing the palette stored in the display card's memory. By cycling the colours that certain indexes referred to, you could, for example, produce a simple series of waves going across an ocean surface, without actually having to directly request that new pixels on the screen be drawn.

apemanzilla #259

apemanzilla's profile picture

1610 posts

Posted 09 October 2015 - 10:11 PM

I was looking at this tweet by Dan again, and I noticed a few things:

File extensions! Programs end in .lua, the palette ends in .pal, and…
Zip archives! (.zip file visible in the screencap) I'm guessing that this means that he has implemented a way for us to use zip archives, which will be pretty neat!
Revamped editor - the default "edit" program has a new UI and also seems to be able to edit palette files instead of just text now.
boot.lua - new on-startup script?
foo.image and alan.image - extensions for paint files? Or maybe a new format entirely?

Edit: Forgot these

Improved multishell - edit program shows filename instead of "edit" in taskbar, an "X" button in the top right corner…
Low-resolution, non standard mouse pointer, that looks like it's part of the system running in the video. Evidence that it's a separate project from CC?
File named "google", without an extension. Not sure what it could be, maybe a dump of an http request? Possible testing of a better HTTP API?

Edited on 09 October 2015 - 08:19 PM

Bomb Bloke #260

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7083 posts

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Posted 09 October 2015 - 10:38 PM

apemanzilla, on 09 October 2015 - 10:11 PM said:
Zip archives! (.zip file visible in the screencap) I'm guessing that this means that he has implemented a way for us to use zip archives, which will be pretty neat!

We can do that now (eg, ElvishJerricco implemented this module into GrinGet).

apemanzilla #261

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1610 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 12:38 AM

Should have specified - the image contains hero (folder) and hero.zip (file) - I believe that he may have implemented a way to create and compress archives, which IIRC no one has been able to do yet because of the intensity of the currently used compression methods.

ElvishJerricco #262

808 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 12:38 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 09 October 2015 - 10:38 PM said:
apemanzilla, on 09 October 2015 - 10:11 PM said:
Zip archives! (.zip file visible in the screencap) I'm guessing that this means that he has implemented a way for us to use zip archives, which will be pretty neat!

We can do that now (eg, ElvishJerricco implemented this module into GrinGet).

Although admittedly that is a very bad implementation, as it relies on loading the entire zip into memory, since we can't do file seeking.

FUNCTION MAN! #263

FUNCTION MAN!'s profile picture

429 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 01:37 AM

File extensions? Oh no

DAN, IF YOU READ THIS:
DO YOU EVEN HEADER, BRO?

Edited on 09 October 2015 - 11:38 PM

Bomb Bloke #264

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:35 AM

apemanzilla, on 10 October 2015 - 12:38 AM said:
Should have specified - the image contains hero (folder) and hero.zip (file) - I believe that he may have implemented a way to create and compress archives, which IIRC no one has been able to do yet because of the intensity of the currently used compression methods.

I'd be rather more inclined to assume he just used his "real" system interface to dump the zip there, then to extract it to the folder. But who knows? I guess I wouldn't be surprised either way. Java, for example, has zip capabilities built into its standard libraries.

There's nothing stopping coders from implementing a Lua zip compressor for ComputerCraft, though. Yeah, Lua isn't the most efficient language for the job, but by no means does that mean we aren't "able" to do it. From where I'm sitting, there just hasn't been much in the way of a point.

Within ComputerCraft, once you've compressed a file up you've gotta deal with the UTF-mangling that applies to any attempts to transmit the thing into / out of your Minecraft server. My Package script deals with that via base64, but it also applies LZW compression while it's at it, so there still isn't terribly much point in furthermore applying zip (that I can see, at least).

ElvishJerricco #265

808 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:57 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 10 October 2015 - 02:35 AM said:
I'd be rather more inclined to assume he just used his "real" system interface to dump the zip there, then to extract it to the folder. But who knows? I guess I wouldn't be surprised either way. Java, for example, has zip capabilities built into its standard libraries.

There's nothing stopping coders from implementing a Lua zip compressor for ComputerCraft, though. Yeah, Lua isn't the most efficient language for the job, but by no means does that mean we aren't "able" to do it. From where I'm sitting, there just hasn't been much in the way of a point.

Within ComputerCraft, once you've compressed a file up you've gotta deal with the UTF-mangling that applies to any attempts to transmit the thing into / out of your Minecraft server. My Package script deals with that via base64, but it also applies LZW compression while it's at it, so there still isn't terribly much point in furthermore applying zip (that I can see, at least).

Yea Grin uses Base64 and Zip with DEFLATE compression. It's… Cumbersome. The performance implications with the way CC does everything are pretty bad.

Bomb Bloke #266

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 10 October 2015 - 03:03 AM

Mind you, you never did strip out those sleep(0)'s…

ElvishJerricco #267

808 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 03:23 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 10 October 2015 - 03:03 AM said:
Mind you, you never did strip out those sleep(0)'s…

Lol yea but they're not the cause. They're only occurring once every 2 or 3 seconds, which means there's still 2 to 3 seconds of processing in between.

apemanzilla #268

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1610 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 06:35 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 10 October 2015 - 03:03 AM said:
Mind you, you never did strip out those sleep(0)'s…

If you did, you'd have a problem with larger files getting killed for not yielding.

Bomb Bloke #269

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 10 October 2015 - 08:00 AM

There's a better method for dealing with that.

CraftedCart #270

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:14 PM

We know the name of the OS now. CraftOS 2.0 (https://twitter.com/...831463633719296)
And Dan made a pac-man game: https://www.youtube....eature=youtu.be

Also, SOUNDS! (.sfx files)

Pretty smooth framerates also

Edited on 10 October 2015 - 12:19 PM

SquidDev #271

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1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:14 PM

Um. Ok. Wow!

This looks pretty impressive. I'm wondering what all those tools he is showing in the video do - looks like Dan has got a well developed framework for it already, though what it does, I don't know.

So looks like paint has been revamped. We knew about scrollbars before. Files now use file:close syntax instead, which personally I think is an improvement, though I'm not sure how he got it working with CC's object system - hoping some of the changes get reflected back into CC, unless it isn't even using Java.

There is definitely sound in there now - there is an editor for ".sfx" with volume, frequency, etc…

Edit: Ninja'd

Edited on 10 October 2015 - 12:20 PM

oeed #272

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:15 PM

Not gonna lie, that's pretty f••king cool.

Graphics are so smooth too.

From the YouTube video:

CraftOS is the Lua programmable, retro computing inspired, virtual operating system originally designed for the hit Minecraft mod "ComputerCraft". CraftOS 2.0 adds a wealth of new graphical and audio capabilities to CraftOS, with a focus on Game Development.

Edited on 10 October 2015 - 12:17 PM

CraftedCart #273

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:22 PM

SquidDev, on 10 October 2015 - 02:14 PM said:
Edit: Ninja'd

Heh Heh Heh… :3

Creator #274

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:32 PM

This is overly amazing. When do we get the source code Dan. You're a god, even more godlike than GabeN. (Besides the FSM)

oeed #275

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:32 PM

SquidDev, on 10 October 2015 - 02:14 PM said:
unless it isn't even using Java.

If it's performance increasing, which it probably would be, I hope it isn't.

I also want to know what version of Lua it's running now. He did seem to mention some months back that he's interested in 5.2.

SquidDev, on 10 October 2015 - 02:14 PM said:
There is definitely sound in there now - there is an editor for ".sfx" with volume, frequency, etc…

Ooooooo yes. Time for some OS sound effects :D/>

Creator, on 10 October 2015 - 02:32 PM said:
This is overly amazing. When do we get the source code Dan. You're a god, even more godlike than GabeN. (Besides the FSM)

Don't make your wishes too big ;)/>

Edited on 10 October 2015 - 12:33 PM

Creator #276

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:34 PM

@oeed, you're fast to respond!

Bomb Bloke #277

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:35 PM

oeed, on 10 October 2015 - 02:32 PM said:
I also want to know what version of Lua it's running now. He did seem to mention some months back that he's interested in 5.2.

I was wondering that myself, just earlier today. 5.2 does seem likely, given what we've got to go by, but that isn't much.

oeed #278

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:37 PM

Creator, on 10 October 2015 - 02:34 PM said:
@oeed, you're fast to respond!

I get email alerts for threads I follow, which, at the moment, is basically just this one.

Bomb Bloke, on 10 October 2015 - 02:35 PM said:
oeed, on 10 October 2015 - 02:32 PM said:
I also want to know what version of Lua it's running now. He did seem to mention some months back that he's interested in 5.2.

I was wondering that myself, just earlier today. 5.2 does seem likely, given what we've got to go by, but that isn't much.

I noticed that 5.3 is out now, I know zero about it, but that's possible too.

Hopefully it uses LuaJIT too.

CraftedCart #279

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:42 PM

Well then: Dan's here again
(Hi! - Good job on your Pac-Man game)

Edited on 10 October 2015 - 12:43 PM

oeed #280

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:49 PM

Actually, one other thing I'd loooove is mouse hover events. You could probably just use mouse_move like mouse_drag but fire when it's not held.

That fits in to the game theme ;)/>

Edited on 10 October 2015 - 12:49 PM

SquidDev #281

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:50 PM

oeed, on 10 October 2015 - 02:37 PM said:
I noticed that 5.3 is out now, I know zero about it, but that's possible too.

Hopefully it uses LuaJIT too.

Ohhh, Lua 5.3 would be nice, mainly for binary operators. LuaJIT would mean that anything using lua bytecode (such as JVML-JIT) would have to have a total rewrite, but would still be pretty awesome!

CraftedCart #282

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 10 October 2015 - 02:52 PM

oeed, on 10 October 2015 - 02:49 PM said:
Actually, one other thing I'd loooove is mouse hover events. You could probably just use mouse_move like mouse_drag but fire when it's not held.

That fits in to the game theme ;)/>

Yes!, mouse x and y variables may be better though
(Or do you mean hover as in park your mouse for a second or 2? - Still, mouse XY Vars would be nice)

Edited on 10 October 2015 - 01:15 PM

Creator #283

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 10 October 2015 - 03:44 PM

I would like to have getMousePos() and isMousePressed() and isKeyPressed(key).

@oeed, how do you get the e-mails?

Edited on 10 October 2015 - 01:45 PM

CraftedCart #284

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 10 October 2015 - 04:01 PM

Creator, on 10 October 2015 - 03:44 PM said:
I would like to have getMousePos() and isMousePressed() and isKeyPressed(key).

@oeed, how do you get the e-mails?

I'm not Oeed, but you can click your username in the top right of the page > My settings. Goto notification options on the left and voila.

Creeper9207 #285

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 04:42 PM

Someone NEEDS to make a 3d engine now XD
<i don't care how badly it preforms> XD

Edited on 10 October 2015 - 02:43 PM

Wojbie #286

724 posts

Location Kinda lost

Posted 10 October 2015 - 04:43 PM

OK lets say that CraftOS 2.0. is standalone thing.

Wonder how long it will take before someone releases "ComputerCraft" emulator for CraftOS 2.0 and kills 9/10 emulators that are out there?

Lignum #287

Lignum's profile picture

570 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 04:53 PM

Spoiler

What's that at the border? It doesn't look like Minecraft, so it's probably standalone…
It's around 1:02 in the video, for reference.

Creator #288

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 10 October 2015 - 04:59 PM

Lignum, on 10 October 2015 - 04:53 PM said:
Spoiler
What's that at the border? It doesn't look like Minecraft, so it's probably standalone…
It's around 1:02 in the video, for reference.

That'd be great news!

KnightMiner #289

KnightMiner's profile picture

187 posts

Location attempt to index "location" (a nil value)

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:07 PM

Looks like his desktop, so he might be using an standalone to write CraftOS 2.0 before actually adding it to ComputerCraft fully.

MKlegoman357 #290

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:08 PM

Dan has already stated that this isn't a mod for Minecraft, so it's not CC.

Creator #291

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:12 PM

This topic is getting around 4-5 post an hour.

I'm not even mad, that's amazing.

SquidDev #292

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:14 PM

Creator, on 10 October 2015 - 05:12 PM said:
This topic is getting around 4-5 post an hour.

I'm not even mad, that's amazing.

What is more incredible is that this started in April - it feels much more recent than that!

Creeper9207 #293

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:25 PM

MKlegoman357, on 10 October 2015 - 05:08 PM said:
Dan has already stated that this isn't a mod for Minecraft, so it's not CC.

This sounds like it is to me, just my two cents.
"CraftOS is the Lua programmable, retro computing inspired, virtual operating system originally designed for the hit Minecraft mod "ComputerCraft". CraftOS 2.0 adds a wealth of new graphical and audio capabilities to CraftOS, with a focus on Game Development."

Creator #294

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:26 PM

How would it be focused on game development?

KnightMiner #295

KnightMiner's profile picture

187 posts

Location attempt to index "location" (a nil value)

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:38 PM

From the sound of it, the goal is an easy API to create custom video games. Like just about anything on the games section of the forums here, only with more advanced abilities.

Exerro #296

Exerro's profile picture

797 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:39 PM

Creeper9207, on 10 October 2015 - 05:25 PM said:
MKlegoman357, on 10 October 2015 - 05:08 PM said:
Dan has already stated that this isn't a mod for Minecraft, so it's not CC.
This sounds like it is to me, just my two cents.
"CraftOS is the Lua programmable, retro computing inspired, virtual operating system originally designed for the hit Minecraft mod "ComputerCraft". CraftOS 2.0 adds a wealth of new graphical and audio capabilities to CraftOS, with a focus on Game Development."

"originally designed for the hit Minecraft mod"

It might have 'evolved' out of minecraft. In fact, I'd say that he only would've said "originally" if it weren't to be used in minecraft.

Edited on 10 October 2015 - 03:39 PM

Gonow32 #297

Gonow32's profile picture

127 posts

Location CubeSpace

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:42 PM

It's possible that there will be a new version of ComputerCraft and a standalone emulator-like version.

Creator #298

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:46 PM

Gonow32, on 10 October 2015 - 05:42 PM said:
It's possible that there will be a new version of ComputerCraft and a standalone emulator-like version.

That is what is happening apparently.

Gonow32 #299

Gonow32's profile picture

127 posts

Location CubeSpace

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:49 PM

Ah, okay, where was this stated? Or did I miss something in the wording of the tweets?

Creator #300

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 10 October 2015 - 05:51 PM

Creeper9207, on 10 October 2015 - 05:25 PM said:
MKlegoman357, on 10 October 2015 - 05:08 PM said:
Dan has already stated that this isn't a mod for Minecraft, so it's not CC.
This sounds like it is to me, just my two cents.
"CraftOS is the Lua programmable, retro computing inspired, virtual operating system originally designed for the hit Minecraft mod "ComputerCraft". CraftOS 2.0 adds a wealth of new graphical and audio capabilities to CraftOS, with a focus on Game Development."

Here! And I don't think you've missed anything.

LeDark Lua #301

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 10 October 2015 - 06:44 PM

Well then, so the pixels are re-color-able or we can: term.setBackgroundColor(colors.make("rgb", 158, 12, 36)) ?

CrazedProgrammer #302

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 10 October 2015 - 08:04 PM

Holy pepperoni this is awesome!
Can't wait to make some APIs and demos for this.

Creator #303

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 10 October 2015 - 08:08 PM

The big question is when it will be released. Can't wait too.

ElvishJerricco #304

808 posts

Posted 10 October 2015 - 09:13 PM

Lignum, on 10 October 2015 - 04:53 PM said:
Spoiler
What's that at the border? It doesn't look like Minecraft, so it's probably standalone…
It's around 1:02 in the video, for reference.

That looks like the OS X Yosemite default background. Definitely a desktop application

Bomb Bloke #305

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 11 October 2015 - 12:04 AM

LeDark Lua, on 10 October 2015 - 06:44 PM said:
Well then, so the pixels are re-color-able or we can: term.setBackgroundColor(colors.make("rgb", 158, 12, 36)) ?

The 16 colour palette is recolourable. That means you can't apply RGB values on a pixel-by-pixel basis, but you can stick an RGB value into your palette and have your your pixels index into that.

That is to say, you can display at most 16 unique colours on your screen at any given time, but you can choose what those colours are.

TheOddByte #306

1852 posts

Location Sweden

Posted 11 October 2015 - 12:16 AM

Don't know if this has been posted on here yet, but this seems awesome! :D/>
https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/652831463633719296
Can't wait until it gets released

Creator #307

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 11 October 2015 - 12:18 AM

Yup, it has been posted. It is still awesome.

Waitdev_ #308

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 11 October 2015 - 11:46 AM

i'm doing my operating system really slow, i don't think i'd have enough time xD

Creator #309

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 11 October 2015 - 11:49 AM

Wait_, on 11 October 2015 - 11:46 AM said:
i'm doing my operating system really slow, i don't think i'd have enough time xD

What do you mean?

oeed #310

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 11 October 2015 - 01:42 PM

Speaking of operating systems…

Edited on 11 October 2015 - 11:45 AM

TheOddByte #311

1852 posts

Location Sweden

Posted 11 October 2015 - 01:45 PM

oeed, on 11 October 2015 - 01:42 PM said:
-snip-

Is that Silica? If so, then can you upload the .love file so that I can try it? ;)/>
Looks awesome by the way.

Creator #312

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 11 October 2015 - 01:51 PM

It really does. Congratulations. The modified emulator ca also be used without Silica, right?

TheOddByte #313

1852 posts

Location Sweden

Posted 11 October 2015 - 01:58 PM

Creator, on 11 October 2015 - 01:51 PM said:
It really does. Congratulations. The modified emulator ca also be used without Silica, right?

You mean Gamax emulator? I don't believe it's that hard to modify the code as it's open-source and it's made in Lua.
But yeah, you can use it without Silica.

dan200 #314

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 11 October 2015 - 04:00 PM

Ooh, that's really pretty. You'll be glad to hear the new project has been written in such a way that it's easy to support new Operating Systems and Window Managers.

Creeper9207 #315

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 11 October 2015 - 04:08 PM

does this next CC include a preformance boost?

TheOddByte #316

1852 posts

Location Sweden

Posted 11 October 2015 - 04:24 PM

Creeper9207, on 11 October 2015 - 04:08 PM said:
does this next CC include a preformance boost?

As others have stated, this is probably not a mod, but a game.

LeDark Lua #317

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 11 October 2015 - 04:33 PM

TheOddByte, on 11 October 2015 - 04:24 PM said:
Creeper9207, on 11 October 2015 - 04:08 PM said:
does this next CC include a preformance boost?
As others have stated, this is probably not a mod, but a game.

*ehm* A program *ehm*

Creator #318

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 11 October 2015 - 04:48 PM

Then it may be almost as fast as standard Lua.

Will it be event driven? Hopefully not.
Why is there a need for a palette, it is not like it will be a multiplayer thing. I would really appreciate 32 bit, or at least 24 bit colors.

LeDark Lua #319

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 11 October 2015 - 04:50 PM

Creator,
Did you saw the "mouse" in the video? Maybe its not event driven.

Creator #320

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 11 October 2015 - 05:12 PM

Hopefully!

CraftedCart #321

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 11 October 2015 - 06:01 PM

I found this, then had an idea for CraftOS 2.0 (https://github.com/D...nalLogic/pngLua (Haven't actually checked if it works))
An actual web browser! With Rendering (Not just displaying text, but formatting it also)

Actually, with the 16 colour restriction, this may be pretty hard…

BTW Dan, what's our storage size limit?

Edited on 11 October 2015 - 04:03 PM

Lyqyd #322

Lyqyd's profile picture

8543 posts

Posted 11 October 2015 - 07:15 PM

I just hope the default shell will have support for I/O redirecting (pipes!). The io API would be a sensible way to do this.

Creator #323

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 11 October 2015 - 08:05 PM

I just saw an os.pullEvent in the video meaning that it will be event driven, which is rather sad because almost no programming language works like this.

At the very least I hope there will be no 10 sec limit.

SquidDev #324

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 11 October 2015 - 09:06 PM

Creator, on 11 October 2015 - 08:05 PM said:
I just saw an os.pullEvent in the video meaning that it will be event driven, which is rather sad because almost no programming language works like this.

Well, it depends. OpenGL is primarily event driven. However, you could always avoid using an event driven section through some sort of input poll method:


os.queueEvent("test_event")
local cursorX, cursorY
while true do
  local e = {os.pullEvent()}
  if e[1] == "test_event" then break end

  if e[1] == "mouse_drag" then
    cursorX = e[2] cursorY = e[3]
  else if ...
  end
end

ElvishJerricco #325

808 posts

Posted 11 October 2015 - 11:36 PM

Lyqyd, on 11 October 2015 - 07:15 PM said:
I just hope the default shell will have support for I/O redirecting (pipes!). The io API would be a sensible way to do this.

This would be wonderful. ClamShell just overwrites the global print and write functions.

Creator, on 11 October 2015 - 08:05 PM said:
I just saw an os.pullEvent in the video meaning that it will be event driven, which is rather sad because almost no programming language works like this.

At the very least I hope there will be no 10 sec limit.

I think the only problem with the event driven architecture is the terminate event. It really throws the whole system for a loop.

oeed #326

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 11 October 2015 - 11:37 PM

dan200, on 11 October 2015 - 04:00 PM said:
Ooh, that's really pretty. You'll be glad to hear the new project has been written in such a way that it's easy to support new Operating Systems and Window Managers.

That's good to hear!

Creator, on 11 October 2015 - 04:48 PM said:
Then it may be almost as fast as standard Lua.

Will it be event driven? Hopefully not.
Why is there a need for a palette, it is not like it will be a multiplayer thing. I would really appreciate 32 bit, or at least 24 bit colors.

To be honest, I think event driven is actually the best way to do it. Given that Lua is single threaded, and CC is meant to be simple to use, it covers all bases. If you want to be able to poll it, as SquidDev mentioned, you could easily make a wrapper around it.

That said, I haven't really used other Lua APIs much. How does Gmod do it?

On the palette, the only problem I see is with multitasking as I've said. Just to make it a bit clear what I mean, if you look at that thing I posted earlier, all the icons in the top bar are meant for the standard colours. However, if the front most program were to change the colours the icons (and, if they changed the greyscale colours, the top bar) mightn't look great. It's a trade off though I guess.

Lyqyd, on 11 October 2015 - 07:15 PM said:
I just hope the default shell will have support for I/O redirecting (pipes!). The io API would be a sensible way to do this.

awsumben13 made a program which did piping which you could use otherwise (and if you haven't already made your own, which I wouldn't be surprised if you had).

Creator, on 11 October 2015 - 08:05 PM said:
At the very least I hope there will be no 10 sec limit.

There's a good reason for that 10 second limit :P/>

I'm looking forward to seeing some sprite based game engines too.

Edited on 12 October 2015 - 12:11 AM

Lyqyd #327

Lyqyd's profile picture

8543 posts

Posted 12 October 2015 - 12:37 AM

oeed, on 11 October 2015 - 11:37 PM said:
Lyqyd, on 11 October 2015 - 07:15 PM said:
I just hope the default shell will have support for I/O redirecting (pipes!). The io API would be a sensible way to do this.
awsumben13 made a program which did piping which you could use otherwise (and if you haven't already made your own, which I wouldn't be surprised if you had).

Yep, I did. My implementation uses the io API for the redirection. It works quite well, and makes enough idiomatic sense with the rest of the environment that I think it'd be a valuable feature. We'll see what Dan decides to do!

Creeper9207 #328

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 12 October 2015 - 03:50 AM

MKlegoman357, on 10 October 2015 - 05:08 PM said:
Dan has already stated that this isn't a mod for Minecraft, so it's not CC.

where did he solidly say this?
because i'm pretty sure its possible to have in minecraft, my reason for saying is because of the webdisplays mod from a while back

H4X0RZ #329

H4X0RZ's profile picture

1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 12 October 2015 - 04:30 AM

Creeper9207, on 12 October 2015 - 03:50 AM said:
MKlegoman357, on 10 October 2015 - 05:08 PM said:
Dan has already stated that this isn't a mod for Minecraft, so it's not CC.

where did he solidly say this?
because i'm pretty sure its possible to have in minecraft, my reason for saying is because of the webdisplays mod from a while back

The reason why this is not for MC is not because of limitations from the graphics POV. It just is a program based on CC. And, from what I saw/read it seems to be a retro PC Emulator/ game enginge.

CaosTECH #330

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 12 October 2015 - 04:45 AM

Its been great to see how far CC has come, I hope that more great updates will come soon, so many amazing things have been made with this little mod and, this little mod, has come a long way. Can't wait till more updates, will love to see what more people will do!

Waitdev_ #331

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 12 October 2015 - 06:36 AM

hmm… i think that pacman 256 recreation gave away most of the mystery, its not the most tense anymore but it is quite intresting

Creator #332

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 12 October 2015 - 07:34 AM

The 10 sec limit had a reason minecraft. Now that we're out of it, there shouldn't be any.

SquidDev #333

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 12 October 2015 - 07:42 AM

Creeper9207, on 12 October 2015 - 03:50 AM said:
MKlegoman357, on 10 October 2015 - 05:08 PM said:
Dan has already stated that this isn't a mod for Minecraft, so it's not CC.

where did he solidly say this?
because i'm pretty sure its possible to have in minecraft, my reason for saying is because of the webdisplays mod from a while back

At Minecon this year, mid-way through the initial burst of teasers, Dan said he was working on something "Non Minecraft Related". He also posts things like "or is it!" when people ask about playing this within Minecraft/Redirection.

oeed #334

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 12 October 2015 - 07:50 AM

Creator, on 12 October 2015 - 07:34 AM said:
The 10 sec limit had a reason minecraft. Now that we're out of it, there shouldn't be any.

Well, not necessarily. 99.95% of the time, if you're getting too long without yielding you're doing something wrong. Removing it will just make those bugs more annoying to deal with. The rare instances where you're doing a long task you can just use small sleeps or other ways of getting around it. It's poor practice to lockup your computer for a task anyway.

SquidDev, on 12 October 2015 - 07:42 AM said:
Creeper9207, on 12 October 2015 - 03:50 AM said:
MKlegoman357, on 10 October 2015 - 05:08 PM said:
Dan has already stated that this isn't a mod for Minecraft, so it's not CC.

where did he solidly say this?
because i'm pretty sure its possible to have in minecraft, my reason for saying is because of the webdisplays mod from a while back

At Minecon this year, mid-way through the initial burst of teasers, Dan said he was working on something "Non Minecraft Related". He also posts things like "or is it!" when people ask about playing this within Minecraft/Redirection.

Yeah it seems pretty clear that it's not in Minecraft. The fact that we saw his desktop background, those things you've listed, the absence of anything turtle or Minecraft world related and (more obviously) this Tweet make it pretty clear that it's not a mod. I think we can put that speculation to bed.

Bomb Bloke #335

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 12 October 2015 - 08:08 AM

Creator, it sounds like what you're wanting is pre-emptive multitasking capabilities. Sure, if you want to run a chunk of code for an extended period without pause, then it'd be nice to be able to do that, but… with Lua's typical co-operative model, that's going to cause problems when someone inevitably tries to make an "OS" and finds they've got no way to clamp down on CPU-hogging threads.

Creeper9207 #336

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 12 October 2015 - 11:00 PM

Thanks oeed, I just wanted confirmation

Creator #337

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 13 October 2015 - 05:29 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 12 October 2015 - 08:08 AM said:
Creator, it sounds like what you're wanting is pre-emptive multitasking capabilities. Sure, if you want to run a chunk of code for an extended period without pause, then it'd be nice to be able to do that, but… with Lua's typical co-operative model, that's going to cause problems when someone inevitably tries to make an "OS" and finds they've got no way to clamp down on CPU-hogging threads.

I see. Thanks.

Viking #338

14 posts

Posted 13 October 2015 - 11:34 AM

I thought it will be a redesigned ComputerCraft for Minecraft. But since it will not be, I guess it means the community is going to continue creating programs for the Minecraft related CC (and for the new game).

oeed #339

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 13 October 2015 - 11:46 AM

Viking, on 13 October 2015 - 11:34 AM said:
I thought it will be a redesigned ComputerCraft for Minecraft. But since it will not be, I guess it means the community is going to continue creating programs for the Minecraft related CC (and for the new game).

Yeah it'll be interesting to see what happens regarding the forums. It'd be silly to start a new forums. Things like Ask a Pro will be pretty unchanged, but the Programs category will be interesting. I guess we might just see them mixed in amongst the others, although it seems strange to have some programs that will be completely incompatible with ComputerCraft with those that are.

Creator #340

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 13 October 2015 - 12:55 PM

Most of the programs have nothing to do with Minecraft and could very well exist without it, so the forums will not be changing much.

KnightMiner #341

KnightMiner's profile picture

187 posts

Location attempt to index "location" (a nil value)

Posted 13 October 2015 - 03:08 PM

Turtle, Pocket, and Command programs would not change, but the rest I can see having 2.0 programs, especially games. A flair might be the easiest way to identify (stating CC, CraftOS 2.0, or both), rather than having a completely separate forum.

Konlab #342

779 posts

Location Kerbin

Posted 13 October 2015 - 04:13 PM

Event system is gone? I saw the sourcecode on the pacman youtube video (Im pro in pausing videos at the right moment) + the sfx editors WOW

Creator #343

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 13 October 2015 - 04:15 PM

The event system is not gone.

MKlegoman357 #344

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 13 October 2015 - 04:20 PM

The event system isn't gone. But, (I think) you can now do:


local event, b = os.pullEvent("key", "char")

For specific events only. Also, ~~there's 'keyboard' API~~ there's a keyboard device:


local keyboard = device.get("keyboard")

...

if keyboard.getKey(keys.up) then
  -- go up
elseif keyboard.getKey(keys.down) then
  -- go down
elseif ...

Edited on 13 October 2015 - 02:23 PM

Creator #345

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 13 October 2015 - 04:28 PM

The second way is actually better in my opinion.

Also, will we have the same fs api?

MKlegoman357 #346

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 13 October 2015 - 04:36 PM

There's 'lua.unserialize()' now, probably instead of textutils API. Also, there's a 'device' API which works similarly to the peripheral API, but instead you get more of the hardware stuff, like:


local gpu = device.get("gpu")
local keyboard = device.get("keyboard")
local speaker = device.get("speaker")

gpu has different functions for maps and images and it can (or must) draw to an image:


gpu.setTarget(window.getImage())

Looks like the 'window' API has replaced the 'term' API.


local screenWidth, screenHeight = window.getSize()

window.setFullscreen(true/false) --# (?) hides/shows the top bar (multishell tabs)

Speaker (unconfirmed documentation):


speaker.play(parameters : table, channel : number)

parameters = {
  volume : number;
  attack : number;
  sustain : number;
  decay : number;
  frequency : number;
  frequencySlide : number;
  frequencyAccel/frequencyAcceleration : number;
  vibratoDepth : number;
  vibratoFrequency : number;
}

The speaker probably has different set of channels and you can only play one sound on one channel at a time, but this is only speculation.

More info might be coming later..

Creator, on 13 October 2015 - 04:28 PM said:
Also, will we have the same fs api?

Probably, but it will use the more Lua OOP standard way:


CraftOS 2.0:
file:close()

CraftOS 1.x:
file.close()

MKlegoman357 #347

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 13 October 2015 - 04:52 PM

Then there's color mapping, which might be the "pallet" thing Dan was showing us before. You can do:


gpu.setColorMapping(colors.white, colors.blue)

And it will probably (?) make so that when you write the color white it will be displayed as blue. Also, you can reset the color right after you draw the changes:


gpu.resetColorMapping(colors.white)

There's also text writing capabilities:


gpu.drawText(x : number, y : number, text : string)

...

gpu.drawText(0, 0, "Hello World!")

--# writes 'Hello World!' on the top-left corner of the screen.

You can also set a global image offset:


gpu.setOffset(offsetX : number, offsetY : number)

which will simply "move" the resulting image by as much as you specify. Default is x=0 and y=0, which is "no offset".

Lyqyd #348

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8543 posts

Posted 13 October 2015 - 05:02 PM

If Dan doesn't create a new forums for it elsewhere (which is possible, of course), I'd imagine a separate category would be used (like the category for the site discussion sections at the bottom), as the new game would benefit from having its own bugs, suggestions, and program sections. This is speculation, I haven't heard anything more than you guys have.

oeed #349

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2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 13 October 2015 - 10:09 PM

MKlegoman357, on 13 October 2015 - 04:52 PM said:
-snip-

Did you see what the pixel drawing functions, as in those to draw induvidual pixels over text, were?

Bomb Bloke #350

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 14 October 2015 - 02:31 AM

MKlegoman357, on 13 October 2015 - 04:36 PM said:
Creator, on 13 October 2015 - 04:28 PM said:
Also, will we have the same fs api?

Probably, but it will use the more Lua OOP standard way:
CraftOS 2.0:
file:close()

CraftOS 1.x:
file.close()

Not sure I can see the point of having fs.open()'s handles work like that, given that they'd then be the same as io.open()'s handles.

MKlegoman357, on 13 October 2015 - 04:52 PM said:
Then there's color mapping, which might be the "pallet" thing Dan was showing us before. You can do:
gpu.setColorMapping(colors.white, colors.blue)
And it will probably (?) make so that when you write the color white it will be displayed as blue. Also, you can reset the color right after you draw the changes:
gpu.resetColorMapping(colors.white)

Assuming it is related to Dan's palette-altering video, you probably wouldn't want to reset "right after": doing so would revert pixels already on-screen, removing the point of remapping in the first place.

(If you don't get what I mean, watch the lower left corner of the video while he tweaks the sliders.)

MKlegoman357 #351

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 14 October 2015 - 05:38 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 14 October 2015 - 02:31 AM said:
Assuming it is related to Dan's palette-altering video, you probably wouldn't want to reset "right after": doing so would revert pixels already on-screen, removing the point of remapping in the first place.

(If you don't get what I mean, watch the lower left corner of the video while he tweaks the sliders.)

That's the interestig part. The functions I showed were called almost at the same time. The colors were remapped, text was drawn and the colors were reset right after.

Bomb Bloke #352

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 14 October 2015 - 05:50 AM

I wonder if he's using it like we use term.setTextColour() now?

Waitdev_ #353

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818 posts

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Posted 14 October 2015 - 06:43 AM

hmm… pixels are 8x8 (pretty sure), and we need to get prepared.
let's center something.


txt = "Hello World!"
w,h = window.getSize() --or term?
window.setCursorPos((w/2)-((#txt*8)/2))
write(txt)

shouldn't be that hard…

Waitdev_ #354

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818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 14 October 2015 - 10:53 AM

speaking of text, i noticed this.
https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/654071645708120065

@DanTwoHundread, on 14 October 2015 - 10:49 AM said:
Tips for writing Unicode-aware Lua code: Lua does not have a string type, it has an "array of bytes" type called "string".

unicode fonts confirmed.

Creator #355

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 14 October 2015 - 11:52 AM

Wait_, on 14 October 2015 - 10:53 AM said:
speaking of text, i noticed this.
https://twitter.com/...071645708120065
@DanTwoHundread, on 14 October 2015 - 10:49 AM said:
Tips for writing Unicode-aware Lua code: Lua does not have a string type, it has an "array of bytes" type called "string".
unicode fonts confirmed.

Finally I can write texts in Bulgarian. That will be so useful with the large Bulgarian audience on the forums.

LeDark Lua #356

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 14 October 2015 - 01:30 PM

Wait_, on 14 October 2015 - 06:43 AM said:
hmm… pixels are 8x8 (pretty sure), and we need to get prepared.
let's center something.
txt = "Hello World!"
w,h = window.getSize() --or term?
window.setCursorPos((w/2)-((#txt*8)/2))
write(txt)
shouldn't be that hard…

*ehm* Wait_, if Dan added like: font.getWidth() or graphics.getFontWidth() or someting then there could be font scaling.

EDIT: and we could get the size of the font easily.

Edited on 14 October 2015 - 11:49 AM

CraftedCart #357

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 14 October 2015 - 08:18 PM

Hex Editors?
https://twitter.com/...370715660099588

Also zoom buttons (or tab management) in the top right?

So what would hex editors be used for?

Edited on 14 October 2015 - 06:19 PM

H4X0RZ #358

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1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 14 October 2015 - 08:19 PM

CraftedCart, on 14 October 2015 - 08:18 PM said:
Hex Editors?
https://twitter.com/...370715660099588

Also zoom buttons in the top right?

So what would hex editors be used for?

Hopefully this also means that the binary bug has been fixed.

MKlegoman357 #359

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 14 October 2015 - 08:29 PM

Here's what it says in the hex editor:


image format=1 width=13 height=12
      2      
      2      
    22222    
   2ff2ff2   
  2fffffff2  
2 2ff0f0ff2 2
2222fffff2222
2222222222222
2 21ff7ff12 2
  22ff7ff22  
 2 2ff7ff2 2 
    22222

EDIT: here's what it produces with paintutils in CC 1.74:

Edited on 14 October 2015 - 06:34 PM

oeed #360

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2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 14 October 2015 - 09:42 PM

Not as good, although very understandable news:

"Ok, focus for the time being is back to @redirectiongame. Finances are such that I can't have two projects in development limbo at a time!"

CaosTECH #361

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 14 October 2015 - 09:49 PM

Whats that supposed to be? From the code it looked like a spaceship, but now it just looks plain creepy

oeed, on 14 October 2015 - 09:42 PM said:
Not as good, although very understandable news:

"Ok, focus for the time being is back to @redirectiongame. Finances are such that I can't have two projects in development limbo at a time!"

I have been waiting to ask this question… why does redirection cost money? If we can play it for free on CC?

Edited on 14 October 2015 - 07:54 PM

dan200 #362

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 14 October 2015 - 09:56 PM

CraftOS 1.x has a back-to-front palette.. flip the colours and it should be more recognisable :)/>

ArchTyler, on 14 October 2015 - 09:49 PM said:
I have been waiting to ask this question… why does redirection cost money? If we can play it for free on CC?

Because I have the right to earn a living? The CC version is more like a promotional demo.

Bomb Bloke #363

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 14 October 2015 - 11:18 PM

Heh, I'd had a hunch something was a bit fishy about that image:

I'm looking forward to Redirection, too. :)/>

Edited on 10 February 2016 - 10:25 PM

apemanzilla #364

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1610 posts

Posted 14 October 2015 - 11:29 PM

Bomb Bloke, on 14 October 2015 - 11:18 PM said:
Heh, I'd had a hunch something was a bit fishy about that image:

I'm looking forward to Redirection, too. :)/>

Ahh, so that's what it is! I had inverted the colors but hadn't recognized it :P/>

Zambonie #365

604 posts

Location Spring Hill, Fl

Posted 15 October 2015 - 12:40 AM

apemanzilla, on 14 October 2015 - 11:29 PM said:
Bomb Bloke, on 14 October 2015 - 11:18 PM said:
Heh, I'd had a hunch something was a bit fishy about that image:

I'm looking forward to Redirection, too. :)/>

Ahh, so that's what it is! I had inverted the colors but hadn't recognized it :P/>

May I ask what it is? I still can't reconize what it is lol.

Bomb Bloke #366

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 15 October 2015 - 02:35 AM

Click on it. ;)/>

CaosTECH #367

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 16 October 2015 - 01:39 AM

xD

oeed #368

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 19 October 2015 - 12:39 PM

I know there's already been a little discussion of the code Dan used in the video, but I wanted to take a look for myself and I might as well post about it anyway; so will probably be some repeated stuff here.

It looks for certain that those 'devices' from the fake bios loading screen are in fact real. He used a GPU, keyboard and speaker. Loading uses this syntax.


gpu = device.get("gpu")

There's also something which puts the program in fullscreen which hides the multishell bar. Not sure how well work that in our operating system, probably ignore it I'd imagine.


window.setFullscreeen(true)

Then the CPU can set a target, which leads me to believe that the GPU isn't actually the thing that is in control of drawing the individual pixels, it's more of a fancy paintuils API.


gpu.setTarget(window.getImage())

There are a ton of GPU functions which I'm not going to look in to much, they're clearly for games, but there are things like image loading and image rotation; so once again it does look like it's a bit like paintutils. It looks like it can load spritesheets too which is nice for games.

One of the best things I noticed was the minimum timer time looks like it's 1 / 60, meaning 60 FPS is theoretically possible. I tweaked our emulator and tried it with Silica. Animations are certainly smoother. It can maintain 60 frames per second when idle, but duration animation it was dipping between about 35 and 25. Hopefully we'll be able to speed that up, and it might be a ton quicker if CraftOS 2.0 uses LuaJIT or something that's not LuaJ.


os.startTimer(1/60)

We've got key checking, as was requested a little earlier, which is a good sign for games. I'm hoping/praying that Dan has a similar thing for the mouse so we can have mouse hovering interactions (I need to hide those close buttons until needed Dan! :P/>)


if keyboard.getKey(keys.q) then

And obviously we've got sounds! I'm really hoping that this will let us do more than just play single sound effects. I'm planning to make a music player that will hopefully be able to play reasonable quality songs, although I know pretty much zero about sound, so all those attack, vibrato stuff is completly foreign to me…. fingers crossed. Here's a sneak peak of a serverly under-baked mock up…


speaker.play(sfx)

And there's a colour mapping function which I think was discussed a little earlier, but seems a little bizzare… jury is still out on that one.

Edited on 19 October 2015 - 10:39 AM

LDDestroier #369

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1715 posts

Location ACDC Town

Posted 19 October 2015 - 01:01 PM

Sprite sheets? Potential 60 FPS? GPU functions?

Does that mean that FCEUX can be ported to CC in the future?

MKlegoman357 #370

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 19 October 2015 - 01:40 PM

oeed, on 19 October 2015 - 12:39 PM said:
One of the best things I noticed was the minimum timer time looks like it's 1 / 60, meaning 60 FPS is theoretically possible. I tweaked our emulator and tried it with Silica. Animations are certainly smoother. It can maintain 60 frames per second when idle, but duration animation it was dipping between about 35 and 25. Hopefully we'll be able to speed that up, and it might be a ton quicker if CraftOS 2.0 uses LuaJIT or something that's not LuaJ.
os.startTimer(1/60)

While watching the video I came to the conclusion that there is no limit, as there shouldn't be. So if you optimize your game enough then it should run on a few hundred or even thousand FPS, depending on your computer.

Bomb Bloke #371

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 19 October 2015 - 03:09 PM

… if you optimise enough, then the draws per second should go down to match the rate of the actual changes you need to draw on screen. 60FPS when "idle" explains why you might only be getting ~30 when things are "animating": you're wasting time by re-processing stuff that's already on the screen.

Any program doing a few thousand FPS is massively inefficient; sure, with some (eg 3D engines - not OSes!) it's impractical to keep track of what needs to be drawn and what doesn't, but even those apply frame rate limiters if their developers have an ounce of sanity. There's no benefit in cranking frame output way past the refresh rate of any monitor, not unless you want to use your computer as a foot-warmer or something.

Speaking of which, it annoys the heck out of me how gamers tend to confuse FPS stutter with "lag". But I digress…

CraftedCart #372

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 19 October 2015 - 03:29 PM

Here's a concise roundup of everything so far
(Still WIP, comment stuff that you want to add)
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1SPNG-buIVE4bz9qp1cZfRc3BqI9m4mUvoQ3MOgCYf3o/edit?usp=sharing

Konlab #373

779 posts

Location Kerbin

Posted 19 October 2015 - 03:34 PM

If your minecraft is running at 20FPS constantly any chance to get 60 FPS from computers?

Bomb Bloke #374

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 19 October 2015 - 03:36 PM

CraftedCart, where are you getting a resolution of 280px x 175px from? I still say it's effectively 320x200, and Dan's comment here strongly supports that.

Edit:

Actually, I've gone and linked to me quoting where you got those figures from. Go figure.

Edited on 19 October 2015 - 01:39 PM

CraftedCart #375

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 19 October 2015 - 03:39 PM

Bomb Bloke, on 19 October 2015 - 03:36 PM said:
CraftedCart, where are you getting a resolution of 280px x 175px from? I still say it's effectively 320x200, and Dan's comment here strongly supports that.

Oh, I just did a search through the topic and 280x175 was one of the things I saw…

oeed #376

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2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 20 October 2015 - 02:49 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 19 October 2015 - 03:09 PM said:
… if you optimise enough, then the draws per second should go down to match the rate of the actual changes you need to draw on screen. 60FPS when "idle" explains why you might only be getting ~30 when things are "animating": you're wasting time by re-processing stuff that's already on the screen.

The way Ben made the animation system was to have it update once a frame, so as often as possible. We've basically got it redrawing whenever something changes, so that's why it's fine when idle. The FPS is capped at 60, it could probably be a ton faster. We'll look in to minimising the processing though.

Waitdev_ #377

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818 posts

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Posted 20 October 2015 - 11:28 AM

hmm… HD nyan cat at 60fps.

Konlab, on 19 October 2015 - 03:34 PM said:
If your minecraft is running at 20FPS constantly any chance to get 60 FPS from computers?

what if its not minecraft though?

Konlab #378

779 posts

Location Kerbin

Posted 21 October 2015 - 06:13 PM

Wait_, on 20 October 2015 - 11:28 AM said:
hmm… HD nyan cat at 60fps.

Konlab, on 19 October 2015 - 03:34 PM said:
If your minecraft is running at 20FPS constantly any chance to get 60 FPS from computers?

what if its not minecraft though?

I heard that It's not minecraft
But what is it then? A real OS?

LeDark Lua #379

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 21 October 2015 - 06:21 PM

Real os: YAY!
Standalone program: YAY!
Mod: Not so much YAY.

Creator #380

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 21 October 2015 - 06:29 PM

It is not a real OS since Dan was running it on an Apple computer.

LeDark Lua #381

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 21 October 2015 - 06:31 PM

Or In an emulator for OS ;)/> You will never know.

EDIT: Actually you will know, when he releases it :)/>

Edited on 21 October 2015 - 04:32 PM

Creator #382

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 21 October 2015 - 06:38 PM

Pretty sure it is a standalone program.

CaosTECH #383

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 21 October 2015 - 08:28 PM

Whatever it is can't wait till its released.

Creeper9207 #384

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224 posts

Posted 22 October 2015 - 03:24 AM

as soon as it comes out, i'll try looking into making or porting a 3d engine

Waitdev_ #385

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818 posts

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Posted 22 October 2015 - 10:46 AM

can we change the palette any time?
if we can, that would make easy fades and better set coloured screens

Bomb Bloke #386

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7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 22 October 2015 - 03:04 PM

If the palette-editing script is capable of it, then I don't see why any other script would not be.

Methinks the editor is simply there to help put across the ideas of what a palette is and what happens when you change one.

Creator #387

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 22 October 2015 - 03:22 PM

Bomb Bloke, on 22 October 2015 - 03:04 PM said:
If the palette-editing script is capable of it, then I don't see why any other script would not be.

Methinks the editor is simply there to help put across the ideas of what a palette is and what happens when you change one.

Exactly. Like the edit program. It can catch key events, but so can any other code.

Waitdev_ #388

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818 posts

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Posted 27 October 2015 - 06:40 AM

nice idea?
https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/657941779539492864
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIZ_gDOrzGk

let's try it

Tag365 #389

Tag365's profile picture

119 posts

Posted 28 October 2015 - 03:43 PM

How are you getting this information exactly? If you tell me I might be able to understand what exactly is going on here.

Creator #390

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 28 October 2015 - 03:50 PM

Twitter?

CraftedCart #391

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 28 October 2015 - 04:45 PM

Tag365, on 28 October 2015 - 03:43 PM said:
How are you getting this information exactly? If you tell me I might be able to understand what exactly is going on here.

<plug> Google Doc I made w/ Twitter Links: https://docs.google....dit?usp=sharing </plug>

Edited on 28 October 2015 - 03:46 PM

CrazedProgrammer #392

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 28 October 2015 - 04:58 PM

CraftedCart, on 28 October 2015 - 04:45 PM said:
Tag365, on 28 October 2015 - 03:43 PM said:
How are you getting this information exactly? If you tell me I might be able to understand what exactly is going on here.

<plug> Google Doc I made w/ Twitter Links: https://docs.google....dit?usp=sharing </plug>

Thanks for making this!
It's really useful. :D/>

oeed #393

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 04 November 2015 - 12:29 AM

I know this has been mentioned many times before, but it seems to have been forgotten somewhat.

Essentially, a better HTTP API would be awesome. I've been thinking about a web browser with these graphics and Silica, which would be quite possible except for one thing, the HTTP API. Quest really had to cheat because it couldn't do anything like cookies so it had to use a really insecure and annoying session ID system which was just….uhhgg.

I know lots of people have mentioned wanting to use OAuth (or something like that) with GitHub and similar services, so an HTTP redo would work wonders for that too.

CraftedCart #394

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 04 November 2015 - 04:04 PM

oeed, on 04 November 2015 - 12:29 AM said:
I know this has been mentioned many times before, but it seems to have been forgotten somewhat. Essentially, a better HTTP API would be awesome. I've been thinking about a web browser with these graphics and Silica, which would be quite possible except for one thing, the HTTP API. Quest really had to cheat because it couldn't do anything like cookies so it had to use a really insecure and annoying session ID system which was just….uhhgg. I know lots of people have mentioned wanting to use OAuth (or something like that) with GitHub and similar services, so an HTTP redo would work wonders for that too.

I gotta say that I've be waiting for a HTTP overhaul for ages. OAuth would be fantastic

CaosTECH #395

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 04 November 2015 - 04:47 PM

This sounds awesome!

Creator #396

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 04 November 2015 - 04:55 PM

It sure does.

dan200 #397

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 04 November 2015 - 05:25 PM

For CraftOS 2 i've added support for all the HTTP methods (post,get,head,delete,put), and sending and receiving a table of headers with each request (actually, i think the latest version of CC has this too). What else do you need?

CaosTECH #398

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 04 November 2015 - 05:26 PM

When will it be released? Or can we have like an alpha or something?

dan200 #399

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 04 November 2015 - 05:28 PM

Sometime after the Steam Release of Redirection. Can only work on so many things at a time.

Creator #400

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 04 November 2015 - 05:29 PM

When is the steam release of redirection?

dan200 #401

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 04 November 2015 - 05:33 PM

Sometime after I finish it!

CaosTECH #402

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 04 November 2015 - 05:35 PM

xD

MKlegoman357 #403

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 04 November 2015 - 05:55 PM

dan200, on 04 November 2015 - 05:25 PM said:
For CraftOS 2 i've added support for all the HTTP methods (post,get,head,delete,put), and sending and receiving a table of headers with each request (actually, i think the latest version of CC has this too). What else do you need?

In the latest CC version you can only send but not receive headers.

Lignum #404

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570 posts

Posted 04 November 2015 - 06:37 PM

dan200, on 04 November 2015 - 05:25 PM said:
For CraftOS 2 i've added support for all the HTTP methods (post,get,head,delete,put), and sending and receiving a table of headers with each request (actually, i think the latest version of CC has this too). What else do you need?

Any chance we can get websockets?

Lemmmy #405

256 posts

Posted 04 November 2015 - 06:38 PM

Lignum, on 04 November 2015 - 06:37 PM said:
dan200, on 04 November 2015 - 05:25 PM said:
For CraftOS 2 i've added support for all the HTTP methods (post,get,head,delete,put), and sending and receiving a table of headers with each request (actually, i think the latest version of CC has this too). What else do you need?

Any chance we can get websockets?

I second this. Websockets are insanely useful when you don't want to have HTTP headers flying around 20 times per second. A practical application for them would be a multiplayer game that works across servers - get a socket.io server running on node.js, then CC clients can freely connect. It would also be nice if SSL websockets were supported - the latest maven version of java-websocket does not support them but the latest jar on git does.

Edit: (also computercraft RTM slack client :3)

Edited on 04 November 2015 - 05:39 PM

oeed #406

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2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 04 November 2015 - 09:58 PM

dan200, on 04 November 2015 - 05:25 PM said:
For CraftOS 2 i've added support for all the HTTP methods (post,get,head,delete,put), and sending and receiving a table of headers with each request (actually, i think the latest version of CC has this too). What else do you need?

Receiving headers was basically the only other thing we needed really, that's how cookies are set and I presume OAuth works through sending and receiving the headers. I can't really think of anything else on the front.

That said, at some point sockets, as Lignum mentioned, would be great in terms of allowing better multiplayer games, which I can see being something people wanting to make even more so than currently.

One thing on receiving headers, in previous version if the response failed (i.e. wasn't 200) it just failed. Is there some mechanism (probably through http.request and the events) to catch the response even if it's 404 or the like? Essentially, do the .get functions wrap and handle the error code in Lua or is it canceled in Java/whatever environment it's running in?

Edited on 04 November 2015 - 09:01 PM

CraftedCart #407

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 05 November 2015 - 07:57 AM

Added HTTP API overhaul to the G.Doc
Also, I've worked with OAuth before (outside of CC). I don't remember needing to use headers (But they are useful for OAuth). PostData what what I needed

dan200 #408

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 05 November 2015 - 11:07 AM

Thanks for the info, I think my overhaul covers everything needed. CC already supports postdata though!

ElvishJerricco #409

808 posts

Posted 05 November 2015 - 11:52 AM

dan200, on 05 November 2015 - 11:07 AM said:
Thanks for the info, I think my overhaul covers everything needed. CC already supports postdata though!

I may have missed something, but I'm surprised no one has mentioned binary HTTP handles. Maybe this isn't irrelevant in CraftOS 2, but the issue with binary strings and undesired automatic unicode conversion makes getting binary data with HTTP literally impossible. It's been mentioned multiple times in the suggestions forum. Either binary HTTP or a fix to the string bug would be amazing.

oeed #410

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 05 November 2015 - 12:00 PM

ElvishJerricco, on 05 November 2015 - 11:52 AM said:
dan200, on 05 November 2015 - 11:07 AM said:
Thanks for the info, I think my overhaul covers everything needed. CC already supports postdata though!

I may have missed something, but I'm surprised no one has mentioned binary HTTP handles. Maybe this isn't irrelevant in CraftOS 2, but the issue with binary strings and undesired automatic unicode conversion makes getting binary data with HTTP literally impossible. It's been mentioned multiple times in the suggestions forum. Either binary HTTP or a fix to the string bug would be amazing.

I believe there was a bit of a hint a while ago in a Tweet about Lua strings being an array of bytes or something that maybe hinted that Dan was trying to fix/had fixed the string bug.

MKlegoman357 #411

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 05 November 2015 - 02:18 PM

Based on the format of errors, CraftOS 2.0 is running the original Lua C implementation, which shouldn't have any string bugs.

Edited on 05 November 2015 - 01:18 PM

Creator #412

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 05 November 2015 - 02:19 PM

Is LuaC faster than the one CC uses?

Lignum #413

Lignum's profile picture

570 posts

Posted 05 November 2015 - 03:32 PM

Creator, on 05 November 2015 - 02:19 PM said:
Is LuaC faster than the one CC uses?

Since C is generally faster than Java and since that's the original Lua implementation, which has been in development for over 20 years, yes, that's probably the case. However, that also depends on what the new project is written in… native calls from within Java aren't exactly fast, mostly because the arguments need to be converted from Java to C. However, if done properly (take LWJGL as an example), you'll end up with little to no overhead.

FUNCTION MAN! #414

FUNCTION MAN!'s profile picture

429 posts

Posted 05 November 2015 - 04:07 PM

Lua is, generally, slow as f***. The virtual machine doesn't do inlining or JITting because that's not cross platform enough. LuaJIT, however, is fast as all hell, even faster than C in some cases.

Creator #415

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 05 November 2015 - 04:08 PM

How is LuaC related to LuaJIT?

CraftedCart #416

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 05 November 2015 - 06:51 PM

dan200, on 05 November 2015 - 11:07 AM said:
Thanks for the info, I think my overhaul covers everything needed. CC already supports postdata though!

I thought it did… It was too fiddly to search up the wiki on my phone though (my lame excuse for, I couldn't be bothered to check)…

ardera #417

ardera's profile picture

463 posts

Location Germany

Posted 06 November 2015 - 12:45 PM

dan200, on 04 November 2015 - 05:25 PM said:
For CraftOS 2 i've added support for all the HTTP methods (post,get,head,delete,put), and sending and receiving a table of headers with each request (actually, i think the latest version of CC has this too). What else do you need?

If you didn't already implement this (but I think you did), HTTP response codes and the possibility to read headers and the response body even on failure.
Raw TCP would be cool too ;)/>

Edited on 06 November 2015 - 11:49 AM

Creator #418

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 06 November 2015 - 12:56 PM

The seven network layers would be cool.

Or is it called protocols?

oeed #419

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 06 November 2015 - 01:00 PM

Creator, on 06 November 2015 - 12:56 PM said:
The seven network layers would be cool.

Or is it called protocols?

Methods ;)/>

ElvishJerricco #420

808 posts

Posted 06 November 2015 - 05:33 PM

Creator, on 05 November 2015 - 04:08 PM said:
How is LuaC related to LuaJIT?

It's sort of not. LuaJIT is its own separate project. It's just also written in C (and this DynASM thing the guy made to go along with C).

SquidDev #421

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 06 November 2015 - 06:46 PM

ElvishJerricco, on 06 November 2015 - 05:33 PM said:
Creator, on 05 November 2015 - 04:08 PM said:
How is LuaC related to LuaJIT?

It's sort of not. LuaJIT is its own separate project. It's just also written in C (and this DynASM thing the guy made to go along with C).

It also can reach the speed of C (that is the language rather than "c" - the speed of light) for some tasks (though most of them are heavily maths based). The interpreter is hand-written in assembly to achieve maximum speed. It is an incredible project. Drools.

oeed #422

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 07 November 2015 - 02:05 AM

I've been doing experiments with putting photos in Silica, I won't be posting screenshots of it or the OS anymore until release just to keep the surprise level high, but I'll say they're better that you'd think.

However, there is one small (maybe small isn't the right word here) issue. If the files are use the paintutils image format they're not exactly light weight… at all. One 320 x 200 (the size of the screen) image was 64kB (as you'd actually expect when you think about it). Given that the OS already uses about 700kB without any images, this isn't exactly great.

I'd propose a bit of discussion about a suitable image format; ideally it'd also include the palette data. I was thinking squishing two pixels in to one (one pixel uses 4 bits, half a byte) but even then a single image would be 32kB. Compression would naturally be the next stage, but I know very little about that.

This might not turn out to be a massive issue, hopefully Dan will increase the storage limit to at least 10 - 20MB, and if that's the case then a couple of 64kB image won't be a huge issue, as it would've been in regular CC.

Edited on 07 November 2015 - 01:05 AM

Bomb Bloke #423

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 07 November 2015 - 02:14 AM

I doubt there'll be a storage limit, but I guess we'll see.

You could probably get a fair bit of reduction by simply implementing basic RLE. Depends on the complexity of the images. Going down to 4bit storage certainly makes sense given that it'd match what you can output; simply make a function that can convert to paintutils format later if need be.

Re-saving the images through package.open() would allow for an easy reduction in size, though at the cost of a bit of processing overhead (edit: though come to think of it, if you're going down that path then you might as well just use my GIF API to load / save everything). You'd be best off implementing multiple techniques, in any case.

Edited on 07 November 2015 - 01:18 AM

Cranium #424

Cranium's profile picture

3790 posts

Location Lincoln, Nebraska

Posted 07 November 2015 - 06:12 PM

Well there's a nice explanation of how old games did their wizardry with their memory limits. Series starts here.

Bomb Bloke #425

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 07 November 2015 - 10:03 PM

Heh. I used to number my sprite columns using powers of two (as opposed to the exponents), made 'em easier to tally up.

He was a bit off in that he was talking in terms of Manufacturer's Megabytes; though I've no doubt he understood the error and just didn't want to complicate his explanation by elaborating on it. Long story short the C64's RAM (like every other device I've ever been aware of) isn't measured that way, and a full screen 4bit image doesn't quite add up to 32KB.

Even colour depth within palettes (which also consume RAM, by the way) was packed down in those days; you might assume each index would consume 24bits, but it was often less. The same technique still sees use today in some image file formats.

Hardware-controlled sprites were fun; they made it very very simple to move multiple images around a screen without worrying about how they might interfere with each other. I've got a hunch Dan may've built something along their lines into COS2.

COOLGAMETUBE #426

COOLGAMETUBE's profile picture

51 posts

Location Germany

Posted 12 November 2015 - 08:01 PM

I want Bling Bling Lamps on the front (I opened a post)

CaosTECH #427

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 13 November 2015 - 12:44 AM

Dan, I played Redirection (The Real Version Not Computercraft Version) And It Was Awesome, But I have a question, why did it raise from 2 - 5 dollars?

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┈┈╲▂▂▂▂╱╲▂▂▂▂╱ֆɨ.┈

oeed #428

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 13 November 2015 - 06:26 AM

ArchTyler, on 13 November 2015 - 12:44 AM said:
Why did it raise from 2 - 5 dollars?

Because it's his main (I think?) source of income… If anything $5 is waaaay too low.

dan200 #429

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 13 November 2015 - 12:16 PM

ArchTyler, on 13 November 2015 - 12:44 AM said:
Dan, I played Redirection (The Real Version Not Computercraft Version) And It Was Awesome, But I have a question, why did it raise from 2 - 5 dollars?

┈┈┈┈╱▔╲▂▂╱▔╲┈┈┈┈
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┈┈╲▂▂▂▂╱╲▂▂▂▂╱ֆɨ.┈

This is a weird way to contact me… but Redirection was never $2. The lowest it has been is $4 on sale.

CaosTECH #430

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 13 November 2015 - 12:34 PM

ArchTyler, on 14 October 2015 - 09:49 PM said:
Whats that supposed to be? From the code it looked like a spaceship, but now it just looks plain creepy

oeed, on 14 October 2015 - 09:42 PM said:
Not as good, although very understandable news:

"Ok, focus for the time being is back to @redirectiongame. Finances are such that I can't have two projects in development limbo at a time!"

I have been waiting to ask this question… why does redirection cost money? If we can play it for free on CC?

Before I asked this I looked at the website and it said 2$

SquidDev #431

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 14 November 2015 - 12:04 PM

I had a go at writing a 3D engine using the Silica emulator, though it is far from perfect:

As you can see there are several glitches with rendering. It does however implement depth testing, so you don't need to sort triangles before drawing. The weird colours are due to the fact that I tried to implement colour blending, which looks much better in Love:

I've also tried to massively optimise it, but it still runs like a snail in CC (but is fine in Love which is even odder). If you want to have a look through the source, it lives on GitHub but is kinda ugly in places. It uses quite a lot of code generation - the matrix, buffer and graphics library are generated by the build file. This should mean the matrix library is slightly quicker, and also means I can generate triangle rendering code that blends z values, colours or whatever you specify - it would be easy to generate a triangle drawer using texture coordinates instead. This also means I can provide triangles with and without colour blending to speed up triangle rasterisation a bit more. This isn't really a "serious" project though, more of a way for me to learn the basics about 3D graphics.

That being said, I'm happy for people to take this and improve it - it is still pretty buggy. Also alpha blending is a thing, though I see no point of it in CC (also it is very buggy due to overlapping triangles - though I'm not sure where all of those lines have come from).

Update:
A couple of minor optimisations later and this can render a spinning cube at about 30fps - though this isn't really practical for anything advanced. Blitting to the screen is still the slowest part of this: drawing to the buffer (and calculating matricies, etc… ) takes 0.00065 seconds, compared with 0.02793 to draw to the screen.

For those interested, you can see a video here. ~~I don't know why it looks so jumpy - my calculations show it is running at 30fps, but it doesn't look like it is.~~ There is also a pastebin here if people fancy a play (the code is really ugly - see above). I guess my next goal will be to get some sort of maze game working.

Another update:
I messed up some stuff and so started the next-frame timer after rendering not before hand, and so ended up running at 15fps instead (though seeing as CC's refresh rate is 20fps it doesn't really matter).

Edited on 14 November 2015 - 03:34 PM

CraftedCart #432

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 14 November 2015 - 03:38 PM

Oooh… Pretty startup screen
https://vine.co/v/iB1EiEBpFOw
https://twitter.com/...552046213505025

Good job on the 3D engine SquidDev - I wouldn't even know where to start coding that.

Edited on 14 November 2015 - 02:43 PM

SquidDev #433

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 14 November 2015 - 03:49 PM

CraftedCart, on 14 November 2015 - 03:38 PM said:
Oooh… Pretty startup screen
https://vine.co/v/iB1EiEBpFOw
https://twitter.com/...552046213505025

Ohhh, that looks nice. Wonder if it just an animation or if that is being calculated (so static frames or if the text position, pixels, etc… are being set through code).

CraftedCart, on 14 November 2015 - 03:38 PM said:
Good job on the 3D engine SquidDev - I wouldn't even know where to start coding that.

Thanks! It is just matrices, lots and lots of them (well like 5).

LeDark Lua #434

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 14 November 2015 - 03:54 PM

aren't there are like 3 matrices? Or I'm wrong….

Lignum #435

Lignum's profile picture

570 posts

Posted 14 November 2015 - 04:03 PM

LeDark Lua, on 14 November 2015 - 03:54 PM said:
aren't there are like 3 matrices? Or I'm wrong….

Yes, usually it's the model, view and projection matrix. I'm not sure about how his 3D engine works, so I guess the other two are implementation details or something?

SquidDev #436

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 14 November 2015 - 04:32 PM

Lignum, on 14 November 2015 - 04:03 PM said:
LeDark Lua, on 14 November 2015 - 03:54 PM said:
aren't there are like 3 matrices? Or I'm wrong….
Yes, usually it's the model, view and projection matrix. I'm not sure about how his 3D engine works, so I guess the other two are implementation details or something?

Normally this is the case, but there is only one important matrix - which is the one every vertex is multiplied by. This example is so simple it doesn't need both a view and model matrix, instead the final matrix is made up of 4 view matrices (translate , rotate in x and y and scale) and one projection. However there is nothing stopping you changing the order: projecting the vertices into 3D space and then scaling them: such as rendering a scene upside down.

oeed #437

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 15 November 2015 - 12:25 AM

SquidDev, on 14 November 2015 - 12:04 PM said:
I had a go at writing a 3D engine using the Silica emulator, though it is far from perfect:
–snip–

Wow. That's really impressive! I'm really looking forward to all the things people are going to make.

Waitdev_ #438

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 15 November 2015 - 01:12 AM

thinking about it, its kind of obvious when you realise it. this is most likely going to be in minecraft, because why call it "CraftOS 2.0" if it wouldn't be in minecraft?
and for that startup video, why is that fullscreen? maybe it is gonna be a real OS.

oeed #439

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 15 November 2015 - 01:42 AM

Wait_, on 15 November 2015 - 01:12 AM said:
thinking about it, its kind of obvious when you realise it. this is most likely going to be in minecraft, because why call it "CraftOS 2.0" if it wouldn't be in minecraft?
and for that startup video, why is that fullscreen? maybe it is gonna be a real OS.

We've covered this numerous times, we're about 90% certain that it's not in Minecraft. Now, it could be, but there's been a ton of evidence suggesting it isn't, including a screenshot of it as a standalone program with the Mac desktop in the background.

Creeper9207 #440

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 15 November 2015 - 02:16 AM

#StarFoxCC
Is that engine actually running at like 15-30fps? if so how many polygons can it handle at that rate

Edited on 15 November 2015 - 01:20 AM

Creator #441

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 15 November 2015 - 06:10 AM

The question is, is it faster than Love2d?

クデル #442

クデル's profile picture

389 posts

Posted 15 November 2015 - 10:28 AM

Creator, on 15 November 2015 - 06:10 AM said:
The question is, is it faster than Love2d?

Dan could be using the Love2d framework for all we know, unless something was previously mentioned that I can't be bothered checking for

SquidDev #443

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 16 November 2015 - 04:14 PM

I was bored:

For reference, this is an 8x8x8 chunk of blocks being rendered - there are about 2600 polygons here which are being drawn in 0.025 seconds, and blitted in 0.038. There are some pretty serious bugs with this: ~~as you can see random lines are being drawn off the edge of triangles: I have no idea why~~ Fixed! Also, when the z coordinate is close to 0, all sorts of things go wrong due to x and y technically being infinite. I'm going to try to fix these, but don't know how it will go.

On a positive note, these textures were rendered with about 20 lines of code which I think is pretty cool, and shows how powerful code generation can be.

Lets be honest though, this isn't ever going to be playable (though it is not too bad running in Love).

Update:
Fixing the additional line bug makes the alpha-blending look much better (though it easy too see that I'm not sorting faces correctly (green is opaque).

Edited on 16 November 2015 - 03:37 PM

Creator #444

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 16 November 2015 - 04:24 PM

Wow, this is extremely sweet.

oeed #445

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 16 November 2015 - 11:23 PM

SquidDev, on 16 November 2015 - 04:14 PM said:
Lets be honest though, this isn't ever going to be playable (though it is not too bad running in Love).

As I mentioned in the Silica Gitter chat, I think it should be quite playable.

Texture-wise, Minecraft textures actually don't look too bad with a palette of 16 colours. (Note: the screenshot below doesn't use the CC colours, but 16 selected colours to best match the textures).

Speed-wise, the rendering is running at 40 FPS (without blitting). Presuming you're using the implementation of blit I used, it is intentionally poorly written to make performance issues more noticeable in Silica and could be quicker.

However, we're not sure what Dan actually has in the GFX API for us to render directly to the screen, but I'm realllllllllllly hoping that it has a good way to send all the changed pixels in one function call. (Honestly, bliting for 200 lines takes quite a while.) demhydraz on the Gitter chat suggested a blit method that used a string, did the entire screen and ignored a certain character (e.g. spaces) for buffering. A multidimensional table would also work, but it'd be slower.

SquidDev #446

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 17 November 2015 - 08:01 AM

oeed, on 16 November 2015 - 11:23 PM said:
However, we're not sure what Dan actually has in the GFX API for us to render directly to the screen, but I'm realllllllllllly hoping that it has a good way to send all the changed pixels in one function call. (Honestly, bliting for 200 lines takes quite a while.) demhydraz on the Gitter chat suggested a blit method that used a string, did the entire screen and ignored a certain character (e.g. spaces) for buffering. A multidimensional table would also work, but it'd be slower.

On the latest screenshot/GIF/whatever, I noticed a gpu.drawMap function, judging by the argument list looks something like gpu.drawMap(x, y, map, no clue…). It is also using gpu.setCol, which is either setColour or setColourPallet. If someone has the time, it might be worth going through the pacman video, and see if we can find more exact function signatures - probably not worth it though.

LeDark Lua #447

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 17 November 2015 - 12:35 PM

SquidDev, on 16 November 2015 - 04:14 PM said:
I was bored:

For reference, this is an 8x8x8 chunk of blocks being rendered - there are about 2600 polygons here which are being drawn in 0.025 seconds, and blitted in 0.038. There are some pretty serious bugs with this: ~~as you can see random lines are being drawn off the edge of triangles: I have no idea why~~ Fixed! Also, when the z coordinate is close to 0, all sorts of things go wrong due to x and y technically being infinite. I'm going to try to fix these, but don't know how it will go.

On a positive note, these textures were rendered with about 20 lines of code which I think is pretty cool, and shows how powerful code generation can be.

Lets be honest though, this isn't ever going to be playable (though it is not too bad running in Love).

Update:
Fixing the additional line bug makes the alpha-blending look much better (though it easy too see that I'm not sorting faces correctly (green is opaque).

Simple fix with z coordinates:


for i=1, #world do
for pol, _ in pairs(world[i]) {
  if pol.z>0 then
   --Draw polygons
  end
}
end

Edited on 17 November 2015 - 11:46 AM

ardera #448

ardera's profile picture

463 posts

Location Germany

Posted 17 November 2015 - 12:44 PM

SquidDev, on 16 November 2015 - 04:14 PM said:
Also, when the z coordinate is close to 0, all sorts of things go wrong due to x and y technically being infinite. I'm going to try to fix these, but don't know how it will go.

There's Frustum Culling, that not only fixes this, but also excludes things that are not in your Field of View, alias "View Frustum". This will improve performance, but it takes some time to implement. Minecraft uses Frustum Culling too.

Are you using a Z-Buffer? I got some ideas on how to implement partly transparent polygons. (Transparency is not possible with standard Z-Buffers)

Also, there's another performance improvement I have, if you're not already using it: Since most polygons in the world space share some vectors, you can give vectors with exactly the same position an index, and apply the transformations for every index. This way you don't transform the same point more than one time.

Edited on 17 November 2015 - 11:46 AM

SquidDev #449

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 17 November 2015 - 01:15 PM

LeDark Lua, on 17 November 2015 - 12:35 PM said:
Simple fix with z coordinates:
for i=1, #world do
for pol, _ in pairs(world[i]) {
  if pol.z>0 then
   --Draw polygons
  end
}
end

I do cull triangles that are outside the render region, but I was under the impression that the z coordinate was between -1 and 1 - though I might be mistaken - everything does break when z reaches 0. I'm kinda stuck on this, because if z > 0, then you are dividing the x and y coordinates by a negative number, so the image is going to flip. This doesn't matter if the entire polygon is outside, but if one point's z > 0 and the other points aren't, then everything blows up.

ardera, on 17 November 2015 - 12:44 PM said:
There's Frustum Culling, that not only fixes this, but also excludes things that are not in your Field of View, alias "View Frustum". This will improve performance, but it takes some time to implement. Minecraft uses Frustum Culling too.

The code I'm currently is a mixture of GlesCraft and my own Minecraft clone. The both implement some form of frustum culling, as does this, its just commented out at the moment because I think it is broken.

ardera, on 17 November 2015 - 12:44 PM said:
Are you using a Z-Buffer? I got some ideas on how to implement partly transparent polygons. (Transparency is not possible with standard Z-Buffers)

That would be awesome! Transparency does work, you just have to sort the polygons which is a pain. I did some reading on order independent transparency but got confused.

ardera, on 17 November 2015 - 12:44 PM said:
Also, there's another performance improvement I have, if you're not already using it: Since most polygons in the world space share some vectors, you can give vectors with exactly the same position an index, and apply the transformations for every index. This way you don't transform the same point more than one time.

Already doing this - though the matrix transformations are pretty minimal, I guess it would add up.

Edited on 17 November 2015 - 12:20 PM

ardera #450

ardera's profile picture

463 posts

Location Germany

Posted 17 November 2015 - 01:35 PM

Also, SquidDev, there is Backface Culling; it'd improve the performance a lot I think, but it's not that easy to implement.

ardera, on 17 November 2015 - 12:44 PM said:
I got some ideas on how to implement partly transparent polygons.

Nevermind, I had this idea 1 or 2 years ago and just checked if it really works, but it turned out it doesn't. Sorry :/

SquidDev #451

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 17 November 2015 - 01:47 PM

ardera, on 17 November 2015 - 01:35 PM said:
Also, SquidDev, there is Backface Culling; it'd improve the performance a lot I think, but it's not that easy to implement.

Backface Culling is one of those things I need to implement - also want to look into implementing a stencil buffer, as well as controlling which buffers are written to - because then we can have Portal!

Edited on 17 November 2015 - 12:48 PM

MKlegoman357 #452

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 17 November 2015 - 04:28 PM

SquidDev, on 17 November 2015 - 08:01 AM said:
On the latest screenshot/GIF/whatever, I noticed a gpu.drawMap function, judging by the argument list looks something like gpu.drawMap(x, y, map, no clue…). It is also using gpu.setCol, which is either setColour or setColourPallet. If someone has the time, it might be worth going through the pacman video, and see if we can find more exact function signatures - probably not worth it though.

I've already covered some things that I saw in the pacman video here. gpu.drawMap() draws a tile map. The tiles are loaded from a simple .image file.

Creeper9207 #453

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 18 November 2015 - 12:15 AM

How is that requiring so many polygons when StarFox required about 100-300 (or, at least i was told)

oeed #454

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 18 November 2015 - 09:30 AM

Creeper9207, on 18 November 2015 - 12:15 AM said:
How is that requiring so many polygons when StarFox required about 100-300 (or, at least i was told)

Actually that's a very good point… I presume the 2600 means that every block has 2 per face and 6 faces. Now, it probably doesn't matter for a demo, but you might want to look in to removing shared edges.

You probably know what it is, in fact you might've already mentioned it somewhere and I missed it, but this page explains it a bit. http://0fps.net/2012...minecraft-game/

Edited on 18 November 2015 - 08:32 AM

Lignum #455

Lignum's profile picture

570 posts

Posted 18 November 2015 - 12:37 PM

oeed, on 18 November 2015 - 09:30 AM said:
Actually that's a very good point… I presume the 2600 means that every block has 2 per face and 6 faces. Now, it probably doesn't matter for a demo, but you might want to look in to removing shared edges.

Index buffers could help cut down the amount of vertices. Though, I'm not sure how that would improve performance (if at all).

SquidDev #456

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 18 November 2015 - 01:56 PM

oeed, on 18 November 2015 - 09:30 AM said:
Actually that's a very good point… I presume the 2600 means that every block has 2 per face and 6 faces. Now, it probably doesn't matter for a demo, but you might want to look in to removing shared edges.

You probably know what it is, in fact you might've already mentioned it somewhere and I missed it, but this page explains it a bit. http://0fps.net/2012...minecraft-game/

I already cull inside faces. I originally implemented "the greedy method" as mentioned in 0fps, and I guess I could look into poly2tri as mentioned here. One thing I need to think about though is how to handle textures - otherwise textures will be stretched over the polygon.

Lignum, on 18 November 2015 - 12:37 PM said:
Index buffers could help cut down the amount of vertices. Though, I'm not sure how that would improve performance (if at all).

As mentioned in this post, I already do do this. The matrix transformations are pretty minimal, but I guess it adds up.

My biggest problem at the moment is culling near the z-plane - I still haven't made any progress on it :(/>. If people feel like helping out, I have a todo list on the GitHub.

Edited on 18 November 2015 - 12:59 PM

Creator #457

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 18 November 2015 - 01:57 PM

Lignum, on 18 November 2015 - 12:37 PM said:
oeed, on 18 November 2015 - 09:30 AM said:
Actually that's a very good point… I presume the 2600 means that every block has 2 per face and 6 faces. Now, it probably doesn't matter for a demo, but you might want to look in to removing shared edges.

Index buffers could help cut down the amount of vertices. Though, I'm not sure how that would improve performance (if at all).

You have to transform less coordinates.

CraftedCart #458

77 posts

Location United Kingdom, Earth

Posted 19 November 2015 - 07:51 AM

There's controller support now

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/667117009688104961?s=09

oeed #459

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM

Private demos now apparently too…

Edited on 19 November 2015 - 11:47 AM

Waitdev_ #460

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818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM

CraftedCart, on 19 November 2015 - 07:51 AM said:
There's controller support now

https://twitter.com/...9688104961?s=09

hmm… i wonder why? and it was fullscreen?

oeed #461

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 19 November 2015 - 08:48 AM

Wait_, on 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM said:
and it was fullscreen?

Actually that's a good point, surprised we overlooked that. It's hard to tell whether it is dynamic resolution or it just scales as both his screen (a MacBook screen) and the CraftOS 2.0 screen both have a 1.6:1 ratio.

Bomb Bloke #462

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 19 November 2015 - 10:43 AM

320x200 is certainly 16:10, and I gather most Macbooks these days are as well. Which was a little surprising to learn: I'd've thought Macbooks would be 16:9.

apemanzilla #463

apemanzilla's profile picture

1610 posts

Posted 19 November 2015 - 02:20 PM

I'm starting to get confused. It looks like Dan is going for a Lua game framework, sort of like Love2D, but for retro-style games (by limiting size and color palette)?

Edited on 19 November 2015 - 01:20 PM

Creator #464

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 19 November 2015 - 03:59 PM

oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM said:
Private demos now apparently too…

We want private demos too. Please, Dan.

Lupus590 #465

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2427 posts

Location UK

Posted 19 November 2015 - 05:50 PM

Creator, on 19 November 2015 - 03:59 PM said:
oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM said:
Private demos now apparently too…

We want private demos too. Please, Dan.

Unless you are an established public figure within the MC/CC community then it's unlikely.

Creator #466

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 19 November 2015 - 05:59 PM

Lupus590, on 19 November 2015 - 05:50 PM said:
Creator, on 19 November 2015 - 03:59 PM said:
oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM said:
Private demos now apparently too…

We want private demos too. Please, Dan.

Unless you are an established public figure within the MC/CC community then it's unlikely.

Still worth a try. Well, even if it is unfair, that's the way life works.

TheOddByte #467

1852 posts

Location Sweden

Posted 19 November 2015 - 06:21 PM

oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM said:
Private demos now apparently too…

Damn, now I'm jealous, I also want to try this out, but atleast we'll probably see more awesome demos as the project progress.

oeed #468

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 19 November 2015 - 08:04 PM

TheOddByte, on 19 November 2015 - 06:21 PM said:
oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM said:
Private demos now apparently too…

Damn, now I'm jealous, I also want to try this out, but atleast we'll probably see more awesome demos as the project progress.

The main thing that irks me is that I did specifically email him about it over a week ago. Now, I'm certainly not saying I should get one, it's just that the email was completely ignored and then he goes around and gives a demo to someone who hasn't been remotely involved.

It's Dan's project so it's up to him, so we'll just have to wait and see.

apemanzilla #469

apemanzilla's profile picture

1610 posts

Posted 19 November 2015 - 08:17 PM

oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:04 PM said:
TheOddByte, on 19 November 2015 - 06:21 PM said:
oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM said:
Private demos now apparently too…

Damn, now I'm jealous, I also want to try this out, but atleast we'll probably see more awesome demos as the project progress.
The main thing that irks me is that I did specifically email him about it over a week ago. Now, I'm certainly not saying I should get one, it's just that the email was completely ignored and then he goes around and gives a demo to someone who hasn't been remotely involved.

It's Dan's project so it's up to him, so we'll just have to wait and see.

I think he's inviting people rather than taking specific requests. He tends to take a while to respond to email/PMs anyways, I'd assume that he's bogged down with all sorts of spam and other requests.

Creator #470

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 19 November 2015 - 08:22 PM

oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:04 PM said:
TheOddByte, on 19 November 2015 - 06:21 PM said:
oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM said:
Private demos now apparently too…

Damn, now I'm jealous, I also want to try this out, but atleast we'll probably see more awesome demos as the project progress.
The main thing that irks me is that I did specifically email him about it over a week ago. Now, I'm certainly not saying I should get one, it's just that the email was completely ignored and then he goes around and gives a demo to someone who hasn't been remotely involved.

It's Dan's project so it's up to him, so we'll just have to wait and see.

Exactly, even though I didn't write an e-mail. I am kinda surprised, I thought you'd get a demo.

Lyqyd #471

Lyqyd's profile picture

8543 posts

Posted 19 November 2015 - 10:57 PM

Guys, let's take a step back, here. If Dan were to pick a single person to give a preview copy to, Direwolf20 is a completely reasonable choice. His LP videos featuring ComputerCraft have probably done more to grow the mod's user base than any other thing or person. He's also got a huge YouTube following, so a video from him showing off CraftOS2.0 could be a huge publicity boost. Yes, we are all excited about the new project coming out, but let's not get drawn into backbiting or bitterness over who might or might not get to play with it before we do. We should mainly be excited that it may already be in a state that Dan would be thinking about sending out a demo!

oeed #472

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 19 November 2015 - 11:03 PM

Lyqyd, on 19 November 2015 - 10:57 PM said:
-snip-

You're right, that is a very good point. The more publicity the better :D/>

Besides, might allow for some extra sneak peaks ;)/>

Creator #473

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 20 November 2015 - 05:21 AM

Lyqyd, on 19 November 2015 - 10:57 PM said:
Guys, let's take a step back, here. If Dan were to pick a single person to give a preview copy to, Direwolf20 is a completely reasonable choice. His LP videos featuring ComputerCraft have probably done more to grow the mod's user base than any other thing or person. He's also got a huge YouTube following, so a video from him showing off CraftOS2.0 could be a huge publicity boost. Yes, we are all excited about the new project coming out, but let's not get drawn into backbiting or bitterness over who might or might not get to play with it before we do. We should mainly be excited that it may already be in a state that Dan would be thinking about sending out a demo!

Thinking about it, you have a point. We do want a lot of users on the forums don't we? (Publicity ==> more users)

dan200 #474

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 20 November 2015 - 06:10 PM

oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:04 PM said:
TheOddByte, on 19 November 2015 - 06:21 PM said:
oeed, on 19 November 2015 - 08:16 AM said:
Private demos now apparently too…

Damn, now I'm jealous, I also want to try this out, but atleast we'll probably see more awesome demos as the project progress.
The main thing that irks me is that I did specifically email him about it over a week ago. Now, I'm certainly not saying I should get one, it's just that the email was completely ignored and then he goes around and gives a demo to someone who hasn't been remotely involved.

It's Dan's project so it's up to him, so we'll just have to wait and see.

Just to clarify, demo meant "demonstration" in this tweet. As in: I was going to show him the project over Skype (and not just because he's a youtuber, Dire and I are friends). I haven't given actual builds to anyone :)/>

Creeper9207 #475

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 20 November 2015 - 10:10 PM

SquidDev, on 16 November 2015 - 04:14 PM said:
I was bored:

For reference, this is an 8x8x8 chunk of blocks being rendered - there are about 2600 polygons here which are being drawn in 0.025 seconds, and blitted in 0.038. There are some pretty serious bugs with this: ~~as you can see random lines are being drawn off the edge of triangles: I have no idea why~~ Fixed! Also, when the z coordinate is close to 0, all sorts of things go wrong due to x and y technically being infinite. I'm going to try to fix these, but don't know how it will go.

On a positive note, these textures were rendered with about 20 lines of code which I think is pretty cool, and shows how powerful code generation can be.

Lets be honest though, this isn't ever going to be playable (though it is not too bad running in Love).

Update:
Fixing the additional line bug makes the alpha-blending look much better (though it easy too see that I'm not sorting faces correctly (green is opaque).

Do you think it may be fast enough to run things about how The SNES's Super FX Chip ran it? (174 Polygons at playable rate?)

EDIT: Also, I personally think Dan is going for the 16-bit feel, This thing's resolution is 320x200, the Genesis' fixed resolution was 320x224, and the SNES has an unfixed resolution from 256x224 to 512x448, also, he's using the Snes controller. I personally think (and hope) he is going for a retro-console style of making things

Edited on 20 November 2015 - 09:13 PM

oeed #476

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 21 November 2015 - 02:40 AM

dan200, on 20 November 2015 - 06:10 PM said:
Just to clarify, demo meant "demonstration" in this tweet. As in: I was going to show him the project over Skype (and not just because he's a youtuber, Dire and I are friends). I haven't given actual builds to anyone :)/>

Ah I see, all good ;)/>

Waitdev_ #477

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 21 November 2015 - 05:56 AM

i still really think dan is watching this post anonymously, there's just one anonymous occasionally… you never know ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Edit: nevermind, dan200 is online and an anonymous user is online aswell. dan200 isn't secretly stalking us.

Edited on 21 November 2015 - 10:32 PM

Lego Stax #478

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 22 November 2015 - 05:01 AM

Do we have any idea as to whether or when CraftOS 2.0 will be released for beta? I'm just super excited to see more of this thing in action.

Bomb Bloke #479

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 22 November 2015 - 05:15 AM

The current schedule has it slated for some time after Redirection is polished for full release.

Creator #480

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 22 November 2015 - 08:03 AM

Maybe it'll come out for christmas? That would be a sweet surprise.

TheOddByte #481

1852 posts

Location Sweden

Posted 22 November 2015 - 01:11 PM

dan200, on 20 November 2015 - 06:10 PM said:
Just to clarify, demo meant "demonstration" in this tweet. As in: I was going to show him the project over Skype (and not just because he's a youtuber, Dire and I are friends). I haven't given actual builds to anyone :)/>

Good that you cleared up all this misunderstanding, can you give us an approximate time until this will be released? I know that the main thing on your schedule right now is Redirection, but to be honest I find this more interesting right now( don't get me wrong, I like Redirection ).
And what type of game is this going to be? An adventure game? A puzzle game? Whatever it is, it seems so frickin' awesome! :D/>

Creeper9207 #482

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 22 November 2015 - 06:33 PM

I just got redirection… (Alpha) IT'S AWESOME!

oeed #483

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 22 November 2015 - 10:39 PM

TheOddByte, on 22 November 2015 - 01:11 PM said:
And what type of game is this going to be? An adventure game? A puzzle game? Whatever it is, it seems so frickin' awesome! :D/>

The game aspect seems to be more the games you make in it, as opposed to being a game itself. This isn't really a game in itself at all.

H4X0RZ #484

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1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 23 November 2015 - 12:10 AM

oeed, on 22 November 2015 - 10:39 PM said:
TheOddByte, on 22 November 2015 - 01:11 PM said:
And what type of game is this going to be? An adventure game? A puzzle game? Whatever it is, it seems so frickin' awesome! :D/>/>

The game aspect seems to be more the games you make in it, as opposed to being a game itself. This isn't really a game in itself at all.

Or maybe it is a game about you finding an old machine, exploring it and doing quests to unlock New APIs untill you finally unlock the power button?

Wojbie #485

724 posts

Location Kinda lost

Posted 23 November 2015 - 01:33 AM

H4X0RZ, on 23 November 2015 - 12:10 AM said:
Or maybe it is a game about you finding an old machine, exploring it and doing quests to unlock New APIs untill you finally unlock the power button?

TIS100 style?

Creeper9207 #486

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 23 November 2015 - 04:52 AM

Guess what i found! XD:
http://www.computercraft.info/forums2/index.php?/topic/4612-wip-os-craftos-20-windows-themed-os-unofficial/

Creator #487

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 23 November 2015 - 09:45 AM

Well, the guy who responded to his post was right, there is CraftOS 2.0. He is the first to ever think of this possibility, except dan most probably.

Anavrins #488

Anavrins's profile picture

756 posts

Posted 23 November 2015 - 07:41 PM

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/668555887053840386
Let's hope :)/>

Creator #489

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 23 November 2015 - 08:13 PM

This is too good to be true!

PS: Maybe its an overhype and actually it turns out to be CC 1.74b.

Bomb Bloke #490

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 23 November 2015 - 09:22 PM

My first guess regarding "good news for ComputerCraft fans" wouldn't necessarily involve CraftOS 2.0, but rather an update to ComputerCraft itself. There are a couple of bug fixes I've been looking forward to.

oeed #491

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 23 November 2015 - 11:16 PM

I'd actually guess it does have something to with CC 2.0 given how little we've heard about regular CC, it'd also be a bit of a troll if it weren't :P/> Either way, CC 2.0 or an update, I'm happy :D/>

HPWebcamAble #492

957 posts

Location Web Development

Posted 24 November 2015 - 03:14 AM

The missing 'want' in that tweet is killing me

Edited on 24 November 2015 - 02:15 AM

Waitdev_ #493

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 24 November 2015 - 06:07 AM

i don't mind if it isn't cc2.0, i've been waiting for an update long enough xD

Agent Silence #494

376 posts

Location [string "FindMe"]:23143: bad argument #1 to 'returnPos' (vector expected, got nil)

Posted 24 November 2015 - 07:47 AM

My first project is going to be recreating Duck Game. Im so excited, can't wait.

Konlab #495

779 posts

Location Kerbin

Posted 24 November 2015 - 03:49 PM

I don't think it will be CraftOS 2.0. Christmas is coming…

LeDark Lua #496

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 24 November 2015 - 03:52 PM

My Christmas present is CC2.0 :)/>

Creator #497

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 24 November 2015 - 04:14 PM

Konlab, on 24 November 2015 - 03:49 PM said:
I don't think it will be CraftOS 2.0. Christmas is coming…

You suggesting CraftOS 2.0 will come out on Christmas?

TheOddByte #498

1852 posts

Location Sweden

Posted 24 November 2015 - 06:02 PM

oeed, on 22 November 2015 - 10:39 PM said:
The game aspect seems to be more the games you make in it, as opposed to being a game itself. This isn't really a game in itself at all.

Well I had this tweet in mind when I wrote that: https://twitter.com/...996342707453952
And about the other posts, I'd be excited if CraftOS 2.0 were to be released soon, but I'd be just as glad to get an update to CC.

Edited on 26 November 2015 - 02:25 PM

Creeper9207 #499

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 25 November 2015 - 01:23 AM

My first project with cc2.0 will be Super Mario Kart

oeed #500

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 25 November 2015 - 01:53 AM

If it is indeed CraftOS 2.0 I was thinking about running another CCJam (coding competition) with the focus on making stuff with CC 2.0.

Thoughts on this? I'm not really sure what school holidays are doing in other places in the world, but in Australia most are wrapping in about a week or two which would be ideal timing.

Creeper9207 #501

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 25 November 2015 - 04:01 AM

oeed, on 25 November 2015 - 01:53 AM said:
If it is indeed CraftOS 2.0 I was thinking about running another CCJam (coding competition) with the focus on making stuff with CC 2.0.

Thoughts on this? I'm not really sure what school holidays are doing in other places in the world, but in Australia most are wrapping in about a week or two which would be ideal timing.

It would be a cool idea around Christmas, (I think everyone gets about a two-week school break) depending on when Dan Releases it

Waitdev_ #502

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 25 November 2015 - 06:29 AM

one thing i might mention:
turtles with Christmas hats :3

CaosTECH #503

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 25 November 2015 - 06:40 AM

School or not I would love to be part of the CCJam

ardera #504

ardera's profile picture

463 posts

Location Germany

Posted 25 November 2015 - 06:26 PM

I'd probably wait a bit with the CraftOS 2.0 Jam a bit, since everyone needs to get to know the API, how everything works, etc. Also I have nearly no time around christmas since my grandparents visit my family very often at that time, and I'm sure that's the same with others too.

oeed #505

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 25 November 2015 - 10:30 PM

ardera, on 25 November 2015 - 06:26 PM said:
I'd probably wait a bit with the CraftOS 2.0 Jam a bit, since everyone needs to get to know the API, how everything works, etc. Also I have nearly no time around christmas since my grandparents visit my family very often at that time, and I'm sure that's the same with others too.

Well if it comes out next week we'd give it two weeks or so for people to learn how to use the new API. The main point of it really is for people to try out using it and see what it can do. While I do understand that many have family visiting it is still a holiday and therefore far better time for most.

Lego Stax #506

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 25 November 2015 - 11:23 PM

I'd be super excited to participate in something like this. Please do this if CraftOS 2.0 comes out. :)/>

Creator #507

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 25 November 2015 - 11:55 PM

Why ask, you can organize it yourself too, LegoStax. (But you'd probably need help.)

CaosTECH #508

226 posts

Location In your closet

Posted 26 November 2015 - 02:55 PM

Creator, on 25 November 2015 - 11:55 PM said:
Why ask, you can organize it yourself too, LegoStax. (But you'd probably need help.)

Yeah but if he does he most likely won't beable to 'submit' a program if hes hosting it. Unless he had someone else to judge for him

Lego Stax #509

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 26 November 2015 - 03:17 PM

Creator, on 25 November 2015 - 11:55 PM said:
Why ask, you can organize it yourself too, LegoStax. (But you'd probably need help.)

I never thought about it like that. Yeah! I'd be happy to help! But, I do not have access to any sort of public server that I would be comfortable using. I'd be happy to be a judge or help out in some way though. :)/>

Creator #510

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 26 November 2015 - 03:25 PM

Lego Stax, on 26 November 2015 - 03:17 PM said:
Creator, on 25 November 2015 - 11:55 PM said:
Why ask, you can organize it yourself too, LegoStax. (But you'd probably need help.)

I never thought about it like that. Yeah! I'd be happy to help! But, I do not have access to any sort of public server that I would be comfortable using. I'd be happy to be a judge or help out in some way though. :)/>

To help you need to organize it and help judging.

Konlab #511

779 posts

Location Kerbin

Posted 26 November 2015 - 05:19 PM

oeed, on 25 November 2015 - 01:53 AM said:
If it is indeed CraftOS 2.0 I was thinking about running another CCJam (coding competition) with the focus on making stuff with CC 2.0.

Thoughts on this? I'm not really sure what school holidays are doing in other places in the world, but in Australia most are wrapping in about a week or two which would be ideal timing.

No holidays here, sorry. We have holidays from 23. Dec to 7. Jan (Christmas)

LeDark Lua #512

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 26 November 2015 - 05:21 PM

We have holidays from: 28Dec to 6Jan.

Creator #513

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 26 November 2015 - 05:30 PM

No holidays on Christmas?

LeDark Lua #514

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 26 November 2015 - 06:17 PM

For me: yes :(/> NO RED PAPA FO ME :(/> jk :D/> )

oeed #515

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 29 November 2015 - 11:29 PM

I see an app icon…

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/670771824196755456

Blue #516

314 posts

Location Glass/UX/main.lua

Posted 30 November 2015 - 06:00 PM

Just an idea,it would be great if CraftOS 2.0 had support for the Raspberry Pi.

LeDark Lua #517

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 30 November 2015 - 06:07 PM

Glass Systems, on 30 November 2015 - 06:00 PM said:
Just an idea,it would be great if CraftOS 2.0 had support for the Raspberry Pi.

Or a real OS. Just saying, I would use it everyday!

Lupus590 #518

Lupus590's profile picture

2427 posts

Location UK

Posted 30 November 2015 - 06:21 PM

If it runs on java (which I guess is a safe assumption) then you should be fine (I think there is an openJDK port for the Pi)

Creator #519

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 30 November 2015 - 06:59 PM

Running it on Java would be slow. Isn't there a C/C++ implementation? I believe it'd be faster.

Creeper9207 #520

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 01 December 2015 - 03:20 AM

C++ was the first implementation ( i beleive ), or it was one of the C-languages

Lupus590 #521

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Posted 01 December 2015 - 08:27 AM

'Normal' Lua is written in C and is therefore compatible with C++. LuaJ is a Java port of Lua, and is written in Java (CC uses LuaJ).

Creator #522

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Posted 01 December 2015 - 08:35 AM

Doesn't luaj have bugs luac hasn't?

ElvishJerricco #523

808 posts

Posted 01 December 2015 - 12:02 PM

Creator, on 30 November 2015 - 06:59 PM said:
Running it on Java would be slow. Isn't there a C/C++ implementation? I believe it'd be faster.

This is a common misconception about Java. It isn't slow. According to benchmarks, it's actually quite fast. The JIT makes it able to keep up with C in real world applications. Occasionally, Java can even beat C, because of its ability to consolidate optimizations between libraries (optimizations through dynamic linking). Truthfully, it will often be on the wrong side of C, and perform marginally slower. But it's forgivable, and still very fast.

Java's performance problems come in the way of the garbage collector, and programming poorly for it. Minecraft is so much less performant than its Win10 and mobile C/C++/C# (whichever it is) equivalents because those versions have been properly optimized, and aren't destroying a GC. Java Minecraft is written such that it hammers the GC, which slows it down significantly.

That said, I have no evidence to claim whether LuaJ is slower or faster than Lua. That's dependent on how well / poorly LuaJ and Lua are written. I'd have to look at benchmarks.

Edited on 01 December 2015 - 02:52 PM

SquidDev #524

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Posted 01 December 2015 - 01:54 PM

ElvishJerricco, on 01 December 2015 - 12:02 PM said:
That said, I have no evidence to claim whether LuaJ is slower or faster than Lua. That's dependent on how well / poorly LuaJ and Lua are written. I'd have to look at benchmarks.

Based off the benchmarks for LuaJ 3.0 some elements run faster, most run slower than native Lua (some are up to half the speed). LuaJC is much faster than Lua, but is still beaten by Lua on some benchmarks. There are some elements of LuaJ which could be optimised - I guess it could also be possible to write a runtime JIT compiler for LuaJ like JRuby has.

FUNCTION MAN! #525

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Posted 01 December 2015 - 10:45 PM

I'd rather see it using LuaJIT than the alternatives. It beats HotSpot by miles, and most times is faster than C for common applications, in both dev-time and run-time.

Creeper9207 #526

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Posted 01 December 2015 - 10:51 PM

Looks like a CC is being made for 1.8 as well

Edited on 01 December 2015 - 09:52 PM

FUNCTION MAN! #527

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 12:39 AM

Yea, but that's boring CC.

Bomb Bloke #528

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 12:41 AM

Sounds like good news to me, but I DO hope that the monitor and bit API bugs are fixed for MC 1.7.10.

FUNCTION MAN! #529

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 12:45 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 02 December 2015 - 12:41 AM said:
Sounds like good news to me, but I DO hope that the monitor and bit API bugs are fixed for MC 1.7.10.

Ah, yes, that would be good news indeed.

oeed #530

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 10:56 AM

Yeah, it was a CC update after all.

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/671824488883965954

Sounds like it'll delay CraftOS 2.0 by a few weeks, but it'll certainly be a great update.

SquidDev #531

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 05:10 PM

Are we allowed to do feature requests? (I know suggestions exists, but most of these have been said there before and I don't want to bump topics).

Lua 5.2
I know Dan has mentioned it - 1.8 is such a change for most mods that I feel it would be fine breaking most programs too. Then we also suffer the pain of updating our code to 1.8! Also I love _ENV, and LuaJ 3.0 is multithreaded.

Binary fix
Its possible, just a pain to do. Something like CCTweaks's IArguments to handle both binary and string arguments would be nice.

Bit operators fix
This is just the matter of casting to long then int. Also, Lua 5.3 uses longs (64 bit) instead of 32 bit integers, so it would be nice to have a bit64 library as well as a bit32 one.

Network API
So CCTweaks doesn't have to. Puppy eyes

I'm really grateful that Dan has started the port (and to those who have sponsored him).

Edited on 02 December 2015 - 04:10 PM

apemanzilla #532

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 07:07 PM

SquidDev, on 02 December 2015 - 05:10 PM said:
Are we allowed to do feature requests? (I know suggestions exists, but most of these have been said there before and I don't want to bump topics).

Lua 5.2
I know Dan has mentioned it - 1.8 is such a change for most mods that I feel it would be fine breaking most programs too. Then we also suffer the pain of updating our code to 1.8! Also I love _ENV, and LuaJ 3.0 is multithreaded.

Binary fix
Its possible, just a pain to do. Something like CCTweaks's IArguments to handle both binary and string arguments would be nice.

Bit operators fix
This is just the matter of casting to long then int. Also, Lua 5.3 uses longs (64 bit) instead of 32 bit integers, so it would be nice to have a bit64 library as well as a bit32 one.

Network API
So CCTweaks doesn't have to. Puppy eyes

I'm really grateful that Dan has started the port (and to those who have sponsored him).

What do you mean by network API?

Creator #533

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 07:23 PM

Like TCP and stuff. Enhanced HTTP.

SquidDev #534

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 08:28 PM

Creator, on 02 December 2015 - 07:23 PM said:
Like TCP and stuff. Enhanced HTTP.

No (though I'd like it and CCTweaks also does it). Actually I meant the ability to extend the wired network with custom components - it is a really useful thing for mod developers to be able to do. Also a turtle refuel API.

Edited on 02 December 2015 - 07:29 PM

Creator #535

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 08:41 PM

SquidDev, on 02 December 2015 - 08:28 PM said:
Creator, on 02 December 2015 - 07:23 PM said:
Like TCP and stuff. Enhanced HTTP.

No (though I'd like it and CCTweaks also does it). Actually I meant the ability to extend the wired network with custom components - it is a really useful thing for mod developers to be able to do. Also a turtle refuel API.

But CC2.0 will be outside of MCN, then why an enhanced modem API?

apemanzilla #536

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 10:04 PM

SquidDev, on 02 December 2015 - 08:28 PM said:
Creator, on 02 December 2015 - 07:23 PM said:
Like TCP and stuff. Enhanced HTTP.

No (though I'd like it and CCTweaks also does it). Actually I meant the ability to extend the wired network with custom components - it is a really useful thing for mod developers to be able to do. Also a turtle refuel API.

Ah, yes, both of those would be useful. I assumed you meant an in-game API.

SquidDev #537

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 10:07 PM

Creator, on 02 December 2015 - 08:41 PM said:
But CC2.0 will be outside of MCN, then why an enhanced modem API?

I was talking about the pending 1.8 release - this has become more of a "look what Dan has tweeted" thread.

Bomb Bloke #538

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 10:11 PM

SquidDev, on 02 December 2015 - 05:10 PM said:
Lua 5.2
I know Dan has mentioned it - 1.8 is such a change for most mods that I feel it would be fine breaking most programs too. Then we also suffer the pain of updating our code to 1.8!

Truth be told, we can already make a start on such updates; there's a config option in ComputerCraft.cfg which attempts to disable all 5.1-specific functions in favour of their 5.2 counterparts.

Beats me how "complete" the conversion is, but I'd wager it's sufficient for most scripters to get their compatibility tweaks in place before 5.2 appears for reals.

FUNCTION MAN! #539

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 11:57 PM

I personally really don't care about Lua 5.2. Lua 5.3 is where it's at! Bitwise operators and utf8 and actual integers yes please.

Creeper9207 #540

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Posted 03 December 2015 - 02:28 AM

Does LuaJ support java 8 or just 7?

Bomb Bloke #541

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Posted 03 December 2015 - 03:50 AM

Most software compiled under an older JDK will operate just fine with a newer JRE. Heck, I still use Java 6 to build the few classes I make (though I'm obviously a bit better about keeping my runtime environments up to date). Granted, compatibility isn't 100% for all programs, but it's pretty good.

In the case of LuaJ, I'm using it just fine under Java 8. I suspect over half of ComputerCraft's userbase is doing the same.

Lupus590 #542

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Posted 03 December 2015 - 08:17 AM

I use java 8 for Minecraft (and everything else) not had any problems caused by it yet.

Creator #543

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Posted 27 December 2015 - 01:18 AM

One thing that would be awesome would be shaders. Like the ones used in Love2D.

Creeper9207 #544

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Posted 01 January 2016 - 02:27 AM

He's working on it again! Yes!

oeed #545

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Posted 01 January 2016 - 09:00 AM

Yeah, so firstly, the suspected resolution confirmed :D/>

Secondly, I have a feeling the hour glass might be indicating when it'll be out. Oh Dan you sneaky bugger ;)/>

In Silica news: I've decided to call the Silica based OS 'Quartz' (quartz is a mineral composed of silica), it's under top secret wraps, but it's gonna be freakin' awesome.

Finally, post number 2000. Woot woot!

ScoutCD10 #546

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Posted 01 January 2016 - 10:15 AM

That's great! Finally a new CraftOS 2.0 sneak peek screenshot! 320x300 resolution confirmed!
When it comes out i will start to recreate Jet Set Willy

CaosTECH #547

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Posted 01 January 2016 - 03:21 PM

This looks awesome… I can't wait to see all the new features

Creeper9207 #548

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Posted 01 January 2016 - 08:37 PM

*downloads silica, no room to download anything else*

oeed #549

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Posted 02 January 2016 - 05:02 AM

Actually, I've just noticed something else…

Current screen coordinates… a cursor…?

I'm placing a bet on mouse_moved or something similar. Mightn't seem huge, but it is really. Mouse hover effects, mouse enter/exit events, context based cursors (loading cursors, etc.) and cool stuff for games.

Creator #550

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Posted 02 January 2016 - 08:47 AM

In my opinion it would be reasonable to get mouse_moved events AND window.getMousePos()

Edited on 02 January 2016 - 09:37 PM

Creeper9207 #551

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Posted 02 January 2016 - 08:52 AM

3d FP Games can be a reality now

MagicCraftMaster #552

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Posted 02 January 2016 - 08:46 PM

Honestly i would just like to see this added to ComputerCraft especially if it is optional tiny pixels it would unlock so many possibilities. for instance if it is tiny pixel with a new program you could create custom Character sets and game sprites would be a thing. even if this is not intended for computercraft i think it should be a feature for the computers and programmers it would be one of the greatest thing to happen yet. Dan200 please be generous and add this or tiny pixels to your mod. :)/>

Bomb Bloke #553

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Posted 03 January 2016 - 02:19 AM

MagicCraftMaster, on 02 January 2016 - 08:46 PM said:
Dan200 please be generous and add this or tiny pixels to your mod. :)/>

Many server owners would probably say, "please be generous, and don't!".

Currently it's possible to represent a regular ComputerCraft display using 1,938 bytes (assuming the data isn't compressed, and assuming it's packaged without wastage). That's for a 51x19 character display requiring two bytes to represent each character (one for the symbol, the other for the text and background colours).

A 320x200 pixel display, on the other hand, would require half a byte per pixel (assuming the same colour depth)… which adds up to 32,000 bytes (over sixteen times the data). Couple that with everything else that goes on in a Minecraft world, and the load on servers adds up.

SquidDev #554

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 09:01 PM

No "new features", but some interesting implementation detail: these three tweets suggest there is some .Net/C/Lua interop going on, which implies that the core is written in .Net, with a conventional Lua VM (rather than a pute Java or .Net implementation). If its written in .Net there might be some scope for plugins, but we will have to see :)/>.

oeed #555

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 10:16 PM

SquidDev, on 07 January 2016 - 09:01 PM said:
No "new features", but some interesting implementation detail: these three tweets suggest there is some .Net/C/Lua interop going on, which implies that the core is written in .Net, with a conventional Lua VM (rather than a pute Java or .Net implementation). If its written in .Net there might be some scope for plugins, but we will have to see :)/>.

I'm still just praying he uses LuaJIT.

There isn't any form of hardware acceleration or GPU access in Lua is there? It does seem a bit restrictive doing everything on CPU.

apemanzilla #556

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Posted 07 January 2016 - 10:29 PM

oeed, on 07 January 2016 - 10:16 PM said:
SquidDev, on 07 January 2016 - 09:01 PM said:
No "new features", but some interesting implementation detail: these three tweets suggest there is some .Net/C/Lua interop going on, which implies that the core is written in .Net, with a conventional Lua VM (rather than a pute Java or .Net implementation). If its written in .Net there might be some scope for plugins, but we will have to see :)/>.

I'm still just praying he uses LuaJIT.

There isn't any form of hardware acceleration or GPU access in Lua is there? It does seem a bit restrictive doing everything on CPU.

Funny you should ask, I had been looking at OpenCL for Lua recently if that's what you mean. Also, there's LuaGL which lets you use OpenGL.

3d6 #557

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Posted 08 January 2016 - 12:31 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 03 January 2016 - 02:19 AM said:
MagicCraftMaster, on 02 January 2016 - 08:46 PM said:
Dan200 please be generous and add this or tiny pixels to your mod. :)/>

Many server owners would probably say, "please be generous, and don't!".

Currently it's possible to represent a regular ComputerCraft display using 1,938 bytes (assuming the data isn't compressed, and assuming it's packaged without wastage). That's for a 51x19 character display requiring two bytes to represent each character (one for the symbol, the other for the text and background colours).

A 320x200 pixel display, on the other hand, would require half a byte per pixel (assuming the same colour depth)… which adds up to 32,000 bytes (over sixteen times the data). Couple that with everything else that goes on in a Minecraft world, and the load on servers adds up.

It could be a system where tiles and their palettes are defined and drawn onto the screen as though they were characters. Everything in the screenshot appears to be in little 8x8 tiles with no more than 8 different colors in each.

CaosTECH #558

226 posts

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Posted 14 January 2016 - 06:44 PM

3d6, on 08 January 2016 - 12:31 AM said:
Bomb Bloke, on 03 January 2016 - 02:19 AM said:
MagicCraftMaster, on 02 January 2016 - 08:46 PM said:
Dan200 please be generous and add this or tiny pixels to your mod. :)/>

Many server owners would probably say, "please be generous, and don't!".

Currently it's possible to represent a regular ComputerCraft display using 1,938 bytes (assuming the data isn't compressed, and assuming it's packaged without wastage). That's for a 51x19 character display requiring two bytes to represent each character (one for the symbol, the other for the text and background colours).

A 320x200 pixel display, on the other hand, would require half a byte per pixel (assuming the same colour depth)… which adds up to 32,000 bytes (over sixteen times the data). Couple that with everything else that goes on in a Minecraft world, and the load on servers adds up.

It could be a system where tiles and their palettes are defined and drawn onto the screen as though they were characters. Everything in the screenshot appears to be in little 8x8 tiles with no more than 8 different colors in each.

does seem so

oeed #559

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Posted 14 January 2016 - 10:10 PM

Looks like Dan's been trying to fix the image format problem too.

I'm interested to know how small the images are. The new format ardera's been creating can get as low as 20% of the original (painutils) size.

Bomb Bloke #560

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Posted 15 January 2016 - 01:05 AM

Off the top of my head, an image like that would be somewhere below 32kb - probably something like half that figure. Hard to be exact as TGA supports RLE.

The paintutils image format is built to be "easy" rather than "efficient". With that, you can draw an image in Notepad if you want to.

FUNCTION MAN! #561

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Posted 15 January 2016 - 01:11 AM

I'm less concerned with image formats and more concerned with the fact that the GPU can access the file system.

HPWebcamAble #562

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Posted 15 January 2016 - 01:15 AM

FUNCTION MAN!, on 15 January 2016 - 01:11 AM said:
I'm less concerned with image formats and more concerned with the fact that the GPU can access the file system.

Why is that concerning?

dan200 #563

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 15 January 2016 - 01:37 AM

I may go back on this later, but right now, the filesystem is a shared resource which all devices can access (as is the main memory). A benefit of this is it allows the Lua CPU to be "just another device" without any special privileges.

oeed #564

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Posted 15 January 2016 - 02:29 AM

FUNCTION MAN!, on 15 January 2016 - 01:11 AM said:
I'm less concerned with image formats and more concerned with the fact that the GPU can access the file system.

I don't really see what's wrong with that. I mean, sure, from a 'real life' perspective it seems odd; but if it makes things simpler I don't see the issue.

oeed #565

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Posted 15 January 2016 - 11:11 PM

Oh Dan you sneaky bugger ;)/>

Given that the CC for 1.8 has been released we're one step closer, although Redirection is probably still top of the list.

Edited on 15 January 2016 - 10:16 PM

cyanisaac #566

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Posted 17 January 2016 - 02:54 AM

oeed, on 15 January 2016 - 11:11 PM said:
Oh Dan you sneaky bugger ;)/>

Given that the CC for 1.8 has been released we're one step closer, although Redirection is probably still top of the list.

I think he's probably counting down the release to Redirection, then CraftOS 2.0 will probably get more attention.

If I had to guess. Maybe he's switched gears and that's a countdown to CraftOS 2.0. Who knows?

justync7 #567

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Posted 17 January 2016 - 04:50 AM

cyanisaac, on 17 January 2016 - 02:54 AM said:
If I had to guess. Maybe he's switched gears and that's a countdown to CraftOS 2.0. Who knows?

What if CraftOS is a part of Redirection this whole time?

Waitdev_ #568

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Posted 17 January 2016 - 09:49 AM

justync7, on 17 January 2016 - 04:50 AM said:
cyanisaac, on 17 January 2016 - 02:54 AM said:
If I had to guess. Maybe he's switched gears and that's a countdown to CraftOS 2.0. Who knows?

What if CraftOS is a part of Redirection this whole time?

ooo

oeed #569

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2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 17 January 2016 - 11:56 AM

cyanisaac, on 17 January 2016 - 02:54 AM said:
I think he's probably counting down the release to Redirection, then CraftOS 2.0 will probably get more attention.

Hmm actually that's probably more correct.

Also, sorry for the massive screenshot, OS X doesn't like scaling retina screenshots :angry:/>

cyanisaac #570

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Posted 17 January 2016 - 08:56 PM

oeed, on 17 January 2016 - 11:56 AM said:
cyanisaac, on 17 January 2016 - 02:54 AM said:
I think he's probably counting down the release to Redirection, then CraftOS 2.0 will probably get more attention.

Hmm actually that's probably more correct.

Also, sorry for the massive screenshot, OS X doesn't like scaling retina screenshots :angry:/>

// offtopic I'm jealous I'm on a nonretina macbook the display is so low res help me

Creator #571

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 20 January 2016 - 02:05 PM

Will the coordinate system start at 0 or at 1? 0 is better.

Wojbie #572

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Posted 20 January 2016 - 02:24 PM

Creator, on 20 January 2016 - 02:05 PM said:
Will the coordinate system start at 0 or at 1? 0 is better.

Well it is Lua based and Lua stuff starts from 1 so if you wanted it to stay logical…

Creator #573

2679 posts

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Posted 20 January 2016 - 03:13 PM

Wojbie, on 20 January 2016 - 02:24 PM said:
Creator, on 20 January 2016 - 02:05 PM said:
Will the coordinate system start at 0 or at 1? 0 is better.
Well it is Lua based and Lua stuff starts from 1 so if you wanted it to stay logical…

Love2D starts at 0. And it is easier for the graphics math to have it be 0.

dan200 #574

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 20 January 2016 - 08:24 PM

Creator, on 20 January 2016 - 02:05 PM said:
Will the coordinate system start at 0 or at 1? 0 is better.

Pixel coords start at 0,0. I initially had them start at 1,1 to be more "lua-like", but it resulted in a lot of code ugly like "tilex = ((pixelx - 1)/tilewidth) + 1". One of the benefits of developing this in private is I can go back on bad API decisions :)/>

Creator #575

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Posted 20 January 2016 - 08:25 PM

dan200, on 20 January 2016 - 08:24 PM said:
Creator, on 20 January 2016 - 02:05 PM said:
Will the coordinate system start at 0 or at 1? 0 is better.

Pixel coords start at 0,0. I initially had them start at 1,1 to be more "lua-like", but it resulted in a lot of code ugly like "tilex = ((pixelx - 1)/tilewidth) + 1". One of the benefits of developing this in private is I can go back on bad API decisions :)/>

Thank you!

Edited on 20 January 2016 - 08:40 PM

oeed #576

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Posted 21 January 2016 - 12:02 AM

dan200, on 20 January 2016 - 08:24 PM said:
Pixel coords start at 0,0. I initially had them start at 1,1 to be more "lua-like", but it resulted in a lot of code ugly like "tilex = ((pixelx - 1)/tilewidth) + 1". One of the benefits of developing this in private is I can go back on bad API decisions :)/>

Oh dear. Not that that's a bad thing, I think it's good.

…it's just the 19 thousand lines I've gotta update to use a zero based coordinate system :P/>

Waitdev_ #577

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Posted 21 January 2016 - 02:01 AM

oeed, on 21 January 2016 - 12:02 AM said:
dan200, on 20 January 2016 - 08:24 PM said:
Pixel coords start at 0,0. I initially had them start at 1,1 to be more "lua-like", but it resulted in a lot of code ugly like "tilex = ((pixelx - 1)/tilewidth) + 1". One of the benefits of developing this in private is I can go back on bad API decisions :)/>

Oh dear. Not that that's a bad thing, I think it's good.

…it's just the 19 thousand lines I've gotta update to use a zero based coordinate system :P/>

well, you could use yer' favourite text editor and sniff out that little "find" tool

Edited on 21 January 2016 - 01:02 AM

apemanzilla #578

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Posted 21 January 2016 - 02:08 AM

Waitdev_, on 21 January 2016 - 02:01 AM said:
oeed, on 21 January 2016 - 12:02 AM said:
dan200, on 20 January 2016 - 08:24 PM said:
Pixel coords start at 0,0. I initially had them start at 1,1 to be more "lua-like", but it resulted in a lot of code ugly like "tilex = ((pixelx - 1)/tilewidth) + 1". One of the benefits of developing this in private is I can go back on bad API decisions :)/>

Oh dear. Not that that's a bad thing, I think it's good.

…it's just the 19 thousand lines I've gotta update to use a zero based coordinate system :P/>
well, you could use yer' favourite text editor and sniff out that little "find" tool

That won't work too well. A lot of basic UI calculations, like text centering, are different depending on whether the pixels start at 0 or 1, for example.

oeed #579

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Posted 22 January 2016 - 03:21 AM

dan200, on 15 January 2016 - 01:37 AM said:
I may go back on this later, but right now, the filesystem is a shared resource which all devices can access (as is the main memory). A benefit of this is it allows the Lua CPU to be "just another device" without any special privileges.

Another thing on the file system, what is the speed like? I noticed a few things slowing down and realised that it was the file system reading files.

Essentially, when you have binary images files that are 24+ kilobytes the fastest I could possibly get it reading was about 0.05 seconds (average of 100 trials) in Minecraft (i.e. not an emulator). It mightn't sound terrible, but that simply isn't viable. If you're trying to display just a handful of those the system will freeze for a noticeable amount of time, especially when the user is used to 60ish FPS.

Here's the code I was using to test it. Note, I'm not actually doing anything with the data. I'm literally just reading the bytes.


local s = os.clock()
local n = 100
for i = 1, n do
  local handle = fs.open( "Arc de Triomphe.ucg", "rb" )
  if handle then
	local read = handle.read
	local lastByte
	repeat
	 lastByte = read()
	until not lastByte
	handle.close()
  end
end
print( "Total time: "..( os.clock() - s ) / n )

Given the likely increase in fairly large binary files, I'd be good if this could be improved upon.

We don't really know much about how the file system works, but if it's fairly similar to the CC method I'd suggest creating a .readAll function for binary files that returns a table of all the bytes (as numbers).

Edited on 22 January 2016 - 02:22 AM

dan200 #580

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 22 January 2016 - 03:42 PM

In CraftOS 2 the API matches the Lua standard: you don't have to read binary files one byte at a time anymore.

Konlab #581

779 posts

Location Kerbin

Posted 22 January 2016 - 06:07 PM

oeed, on 21 January 2016 - 12:02 AM said:
dan200, on 20 January 2016 - 08:24 PM said:
Pixel coords start at 0,0. I initially had them start at 1,1 to be more "lua-like", but it resulted in a lot of code ugly like "tilex = ((pixelx - 1)/tilewidth) + 1". One of the benefits of developing this in private is I can go back on bad API decisions :)/>/>

Oh dear. Not that that's a bad thing, I think it's good.

…it's just the 19 thousand lines I've gotta update to use a zero based coordinate system :P/>/>

Or just write a term redirect that changes every position to position - 1

Creator #582

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 22 January 2016 - 06:12 PM

Konlab, on 22 January 2016 - 06:07 PM said:
oeed, on 21 January 2016 - 12:02 AM said:
dan200, on 20 January 2016 - 08:24 PM said:
Pixel coords start at 0,0. I initially had them start at 1,1 to be more "lua-like", but it resulted in a lot of code ugly like "tilex = ((pixelx - 1)/tilewidth) + 1". One of the benefits of developing this in private is I can go back on bad API decisions :)/>/>

Oh dear. Not that that's a bad thing, I think it's good.

…it's just the 19 thousand lines I've gotta update to use a zero based coordinate system :P/>/>
Or just write a term redirect that changes every position to position - 1

It adds an extra layer of operations significantly slowing everything down.

Konlab #583

779 posts

Location Kerbin

Posted 22 January 2016 - 06:20 PM

Creator, on 22 January 2016 - 06:12 PM said:
Konlab, on 22 January 2016 - 06:07 PM said:
oeed, on 21 January 2016 - 12:02 AM said:
dan200, on 20 January 2016 - 08:24 PM said:
Pixel coords start at 0,0. I initially had them start at 1,1 to be more "lua-like", but it resulted in a lot of code ugly like "tilex = ((pixelx - 1)/tilewidth) + 1". One of the benefits of developing this in private is I can go back on bad API decisions :)/>/>/>

Oh dear. Not that that's a bad thing, I think it's good.

…it's just the 19 thousand lines I've gotta update to use a zero based coordinate system :P/>/>/>
Or just write a term redirect that changes every position to position - 1

It adds an extra layer of operations significantly slowing everything down.

I don't think there is a better solution other than changing those 19k lines.

Creator #584

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 22 January 2016 - 06:24 PM

If you really want performance, you change these 300-400 lines once and never think about them again. Else you write this redirect and deal with certain events, decrease by one where you must and let it be a pain.

Exerro #585

Exerro's profile picture

797 posts

Posted 22 January 2016 - 06:54 PM

Oeed, remember it's just the actual screen drawing that needs to be changed. Internal buffers can still have a 1-based coordinate system, although it might be confusing to users having to switch between that and the 0-based CraftOS system.

oeed #586

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 22 January 2016 - 11:41 PM

dan200, on 22 January 2016 - 03:42 PM said:
In CraftOS 2 the API matches the Lua standard: you don't have to read binary files one byte at a time anymore.

Awesome! Thanks ;)/>

Exerro, on 22 January 2016 - 06:54 PM said:
Oeed, remember it's just the actual screen drawing that needs to be changed. Internal buffers can still have a 1-based coordinate system, although it might be confusing to users having to switch between that and the 0-based CraftOS system.

Oh yeah I know. I could easily make it render from 0, 0 instead of 1, 1. But as you said, it's confusing for users to use a one based system when CraftOS uses a zero based system.

Creeper9207 #587

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 24 January 2016 - 04:00 AM

Thing I'm most hoping for is websockets

oeed #588

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 24 January 2016 - 10:01 AM

Creeper9207, on 24 January 2016 - 04:00 AM said:
Thing I'm most hoping for is websockets

A while ago Dan talked about the changes he made to HTTP. Basically, he's added sending or receiving headers (whichever one wasn't already there) and all the HTTP verbs. I don't recall him mentioning anything else though. With a strong focus on games, I wouldn't be too surprised if he adds it though at some point.

cyanisaac #589

cyanisaac's profile picture

385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 25 January 2016 - 11:48 PM

You know what I want to see is if stuff actually gets sold with CraftOS 2.0

I mean maybe nothing serious like real money, but could you imagine selling your OSes and programs for CraftOS 2.0 for Krist or something? That would be interesting…

Lemmmy #590

256 posts

Posted 25 January 2016 - 11:52 PM

will it have more colours

Bomb Bloke #591

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 25 January 2016 - 11:57 PM

Lemmmy, on 25 January 2016 - 11:52 PM said:
will it have more colours

Last we saw, CraftOS 2.0 will have a 24bit adjustable palette with sixteen colour indexes. That is to say, you can have up to sixteen unique colours on screen at once, but they can be any 24bit colour values you like.

oeed #592

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 26 January 2016 - 01:18 AM

cyanisaac, on 25 January 2016 - 11:48 PM said:
You know what I want to see is if stuff actually gets sold with CraftOS 2.0

I mean maybe nothing serious like real money, but could you imagine selling your OSes and programs for CraftOS 2.0 for Krist or something? That would be interesting…

It'd certainly make developing for it far more attractive. However, given that a significant majority of audience are fairly young (although that could change without a Minecraft connection), most of which probably won't have credit cards, I can't really see it being very likely sadly.

cyanisaac #593

cyanisaac's profile picture

385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 26 January 2016 - 01:48 AM

oeed, on 26 January 2016 - 01:18 AM said:
cyanisaac, on 25 January 2016 - 11:48 PM said:
You know what I want to see is if stuff actually gets sold with CraftOS 2.0

I mean maybe nothing serious like real money, but could you imagine selling your OSes and programs for CraftOS 2.0 for Krist or something? That would be interesting…

It'd certainly make developing for it far more attractive. However, given that a significant majority of audience are fairly young (although that could change without a Minecraft connection), most of which probably won't have credit cards, I can't really see it being very likely sadly.

Well again that would apply for real money. But Krist is definitely something that could be used to buy COS2.0 stuff. It wouldn't be valuable, but it would be fun.

Heck that's an idea, what if OSes integrated Krist as a payment method for additional programs + features, app stores etc. I'm gonna write some of my ideas down somewhere!

wilcomega #594

wilcomega's profile picture

453 posts

Location Holland

Posted 26 January 2016 - 08:26 AM

cyanisaac, on 26 January 2016 - 01:48 AM said:
oeed, on 26 January 2016 - 01:18 AM said:
cyanisaac, on 25 January 2016 - 11:48 PM said:
You know what I want to see is if stuff actually gets sold with CraftOS 2.0

I mean maybe nothing serious like real money, but could you imagine selling your OSes and programs for CraftOS 2.0 for Krist or something? That would be interesting…

It'd certainly make developing for it far more attractive. However, given that a significant majority of audience are fairly young (although that could change without a Minecraft connection), most of which probably won't have credit cards, I can't really see it being very likely sadly.

Well again that would apply for real money. But Krist is definitely something that could be used to buy COS2.0 stuff. It wouldn't be valuable, but it would be fun.

Heck that's an idea, what if OSes integrated Krist as a payment method for additional programs + features, app stores etc. I'm gonna write some of my ideas down somewhere!

or a real life website where you spend krist to buy programs (licensen to said program). The you can download and activate the software

cyanisaac #595

cyanisaac's profile picture

385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 28 January 2016 - 02:19 AM

In CraftOS2.0, something that would be helpful would be if every virtual computer (assuming it works like this) has an unmodifiable (constant) unique identifier. I think this could be useful for certain things.

oeed #596

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 28 January 2016 - 08:48 AM

cyanisaac, on 28 January 2016 - 02:19 AM said:
In CraftOS2.0, something that would be helpful would be if every virtual computer (assuming it works like this) has an unmodifiable (constant) unique identifier. I think this could be useful for certain things.

Well yeah at the moment we don't know whether there is support for multiple computers. I'd be somewhat surprised if there isn't though.

Wouldn't os.getComputerID do what you want? Or do you mean unique as in all my virtual computers have a different identifiers to your ones?

cyanisaac #597

cyanisaac's profile picture

385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 28 January 2016 - 09:57 PM

oeed, on 28 January 2016 - 08:48 AM said:
cyanisaac, on 28 January 2016 - 02:19 AM said:
In CraftOS2.0, something that would be helpful would be if every virtual computer (assuming it works like this) has an unmodifiable (constant) unique identifier. I think this could be useful for certain things.
Well yeah at the moment we don't know whether there is support for multiple computers. I'd be somewhat surprised if there isn't though.

Wouldn't os.getComputerID do what you want? Or do you mean unique as in all my virtual computers have a different identifiers to your ones?

Completely unique, so my computers would have different IDs to yours. That way services could utilize it to keep track of one computer from any other one.

Creator #598

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 28 January 2016 - 10:46 PM

cyanisaac, on 28 January 2016 - 09:57 PM said:
oeed, on 28 January 2016 - 08:48 AM said:
cyanisaac, on 28 January 2016 - 02:19 AM said:
In CraftOS2.0, something that would be helpful would be if every virtual computer (assuming it works like this) has an unmodifiable (constant) unique identifier. I think this could be useful for certain things.
Well yeah at the moment we don't know whether there is support for multiple computers. I'd be somewhat surprised if there isn't though.

Wouldn't os.getComputerID do what you want? Or do you mean unique as in all my virtual computers have a different identifiers to your ones?

Completely unique, so my computers would have different IDs to yours. That way services could utilize it to keep track of one computer from any other one.

This would mean that there is a real life server somewhere keeping track of which IDs have been taken. Seriously guys, keep it simple. CraftOS 2.0 is similar to Love2D: it is a game engine, not a physical computer. The thing about using krist for payment has several disadvantages:

people are motivated enough to code without receiving a reward you can't even spend. Just take a look at the program section.
it keeps you under pressure to meet a certain standard, so that people will pay. Computercraft is supposed to be a hobby, not a full-time job.
If someone want to make you pay for something, just find a FOSS alternative.
Since we are not allowed to load binaries, I can just strip out the part of the code that takes care of licensing.

So by all means, ask for krist and watch as nobody pays for it, because we just remove the 3-4 lines of code that make us pay krist. By the way, I will not be part of the krist greedy part of the community as I prefer to code and learn from it, this being the benefit I receive from giving you my programs.

Bomb Bloke #599

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 28 January 2016 - 11:06 PM

oeed, on 28 January 2016 - 08:48 AM said:
Well yeah at the moment we don't know whether there is support for multiple computers. I'd be somewhat surprised if there isn't though.

I'd be amazed if there is - I mean, sure, there's likely to be a method for different instances of the environment to communicate over eg the internet, but I doubt we'll be running multiple "machines" through the one VM as we do with ComputerCraft.

oeed #600

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 29 January 2016 - 12:38 AM

Creator, on 28 January 2016 - 10:46 PM said:
it keeps you under pressure to meet a certain standard

Not a bad thing. At all.

Bomb Bloke, on 28 January 2016 - 11:06 PM said:
I'd be amazed if there is - I mean, sure, there's likely to be a method for different instances of the environment to communicate over eg the internet, but I doubt we'll be running multiple "machines" through the one VM as we do with ComputerCraft.

I guess it really depends on how he's written it. I was thinking along the lines of most emulators have the capability to run multiple computers. If you're on Windows you'd probably be able to fire up another instance of the program, but you can't do that on Mac.

Given that there probably wouldn't be communication between them I can't really see it being necessary though.

MKlegoman357 #601

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 29 January 2016 - 12:06 PM

oeed, on 29 January 2016 - 12:38 AM said:
Given that there probably wouldn't be communication between them I can't really see it being necessary though.

I wouldn't say so. I like to have two or three computers running to have different environments and files on them, writing the main program in one computer, testing on another, etc..

Lupus590 #602

Lupus590's profile picture

2427 posts

Location UK

Posted 29 January 2016 - 12:45 PM

People will find a need for the strangest of features.

Creator #603

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 29 January 2016 - 09:54 PM

oeed, on 29 January 2016 - 12:38 AM said:
Creator, on 28 January 2016 - 10:46 PM said:
it keeps you under pressure to meet a certain standard
Not a bad thing. At all.

What I mean is that you code to meet the standard, instead of for fun or for self-education.

cyanisaac #604

cyanisaac's profile picture

385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 30 January 2016 - 05:23 AM

Creator, on 29 January 2016 - 09:54 PM said:
oeed, on 29 January 2016 - 12:38 AM said:
Creator, on 28 January 2016 - 10:46 PM said:
it keeps you under pressure to meet a certain standard
Not a bad thing. At all.

What I mean is that you code to meet the standard, instead of for fun or for self-education.

But through coding for that standard you would learn stuff, and honestly programming to earn Krist is still useless, but it would be "fun" to see how many people you could get to buy it.

So I'm still not convinced that it's a stupid way to go.

SquidDev #605

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 30 January 2016 - 09:27 AM

cyanisaac, on 30 January 2016 - 05:23 AM said:
But through coding for that standard you would learn stuff, and honestly programming to earn Krist is still useless, but it would be "fun" to see how many people you could get to buy it.

So I'm still not convinced that it's a stupid way to go.

If Krist were to be involved at all I feel 'donations' would be the way to go. This means there is no obligation to pay for things but people can show their appreciation.

H4X0RZ #606

H4X0RZ's profile picture

1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 30 January 2016 - 11:52 AM

The problem is, there is no easy way to get krist. Mining is hard af. And because it's worth nothing, you can't convert it either

Creator #607

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 30 January 2016 - 03:16 PM

SquidDev, on 30 January 2016 - 09:27 AM said:
cyanisaac, on 30 January 2016 - 05:23 AM said:
But through coding for that standard you would learn stuff, and honestly programming to earn Krist is still useless, but it would be "fun" to see how many people you could get to buy it.

So I'm still not convinced that it's a stupid way to go.

If Krist were to be involved at all I feel 'donations' would be the way to go. This means there is no obligation to pay for things but people can show their appreciation.

This sounds like a good idea.

FUNCTION MAN! #608

FUNCTION MAN!'s profile picture

429 posts

Posted 30 January 2016 - 08:43 PM

Creator, on 28 January 2016 - 10:46 PM said:
cyanisaac, on 28 January 2016 - 09:57 PM said:
oeed, on 28 January 2016 - 08:48 AM said:
cyanisaac, on 28 January 2016 - 02:19 AM said:
In CraftOS2.0, something that would be helpful would be if every virtual computer (assuming it works like this) has an unmodifiable (constant) unique identifier. I think this could be useful for certain things.
Well yeah at the moment we don't know whether there is support for multiple computers. I'd be somewhat surprised if there isn't though.

Wouldn't os.getComputerID do what you want? Or do you mean unique as in all my virtual computers have a different identifiers to your ones?

Completely unique, so my computers would have different IDs to yours. That way services could utilize it to keep track of one computer from any other one.

This would mean that there is a real life server somewhere keeping track of which IDs have been taken. Seriously guys, keep it simple. CraftOS 2.0 is similar to Love2D: it is a game engine, not a physical computer. The thing about using krist for payment has several disadvantages:
people are motivated enough to code without receiving a reward you can't even spend. Just take a look at the program section.
it keeps you under pressure to meet a certain standard, so that people will pay. Computercraft is supposed to be a hobby, not a full-time job.
If someone want to make you pay for something, just find a FOSS alternative.
Since we are not allowed to load binaries, I can just strip out the part of the code that takes care of licensing.

So by all means, ask for krist and watch as nobody pays for it, because we just remove the 3-4 lines of code that make us pay krist. By the way, I will not be part of the krist greedy part of the community as I prefer to code and learn from it, this being the benefit I receive from giving you my programs.

Um, I can load binaries just fine. You know, by doing load(binary, 'something', nil or 't', env).

wilcomega #609

wilcomega's profile picture

453 posts

Location Holland

Posted 30 January 2016 - 10:43 PM

FUNCTION MAN!, on 30 January 2016 - 08:43 PM said:
Creator, on 28 January 2016 - 10:46 PM said:
…

Um, I can load binaries just fine. You know, by doing load(binary, 'something', nil or 't', env).

I think hee meant post it on the forums, since they cannot be checked for malicious code

Edited on 30 January 2016 - 09:43 PM

FUNCTION MAN! #610

FUNCTION MAN!'s profile picture

429 posts

Posted 30 January 2016 - 10:46 PM

He said load. Not post. Also, a decompiler exists.

wilcomega #611

wilcomega's profile picture

453 posts

Location Holland

Posted 30 January 2016 - 10:55 PM

i said "i think" which means that its not a fact. also, what an attitude

Creator #612

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 31 January 2016 - 05:21 AM

I meant that in the CC bios load is modified so that binaries cannot be loaded.

Edited on 31 January 2016 - 04:21 AM

ardera #613

ardera's profile picture

463 posts

Location Germany

Posted 31 January 2016 - 10:41 AM

H4X0RZ, on 30 January 2016 - 11:52 AM said:
The problem is, there is no easy way to get krist. Mining is hard af. And because it's worth nothing, you can't convert it either

Money should be not easy to get. And it's at least worth something, because it's not easy to get. Krist is worth computing time.

Bomb Bloke #614

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 31 January 2016 - 11:07 AM

Careful, that sort of logic leads to seeing value in smurfberries!

Wojbie #615

724 posts

Location Kinda lost

Posted 31 January 2016 - 12:15 PM

Money that 90% of people are unable to get is money that is worthless for 90% of people.

H4X0RZ #616

H4X0RZ's profile picture

1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 31 January 2016 - 12:54 PM

Also, btw, are domains a valid way to pay too? If so, what would be their price?

ardera #617

ardera's profile picture

463 posts

Location Germany

Posted 31 January 2016 - 12:54 PM

Wojbie, on 31 January 2016 - 12:15 PM said:
Money that 90% of people are unable to get is money that is worthless for 90% of people.

Money that 100% of people are able to get using nothing is worthless for 100% of people
Also, everyone is able to get krist.

See it like that: if it was very easy to get krist, it'd be worth even less ;)/>

Edited on 31 January 2016 - 11:59 AM

Lupus590 #618

Lupus590's profile picture

2427 posts

Location UK

Posted 31 January 2016 - 02:23 PM

And if you don't want it and have no use for it (other than to give to other, maybe) then it is even more worthless. [/personal opinion]

Edited on 31 January 2016 - 01:23 PM

ProjectxCyan #619

1 posts

Location California, United States

Posted 03 February 2016 - 04:55 AM

It's exciting to think of all of the possibilities though. We've been wanting to tackle a more advanced OS with a pretty GUI, actual file encryption and security etc. CraftOS 2.0 is exciting, it will actually bring that possibility to the table.

apemanzilla #620

apemanzilla's profile picture

1610 posts

Posted 03 February 2016 - 03:13 PM

ProjectxCyan, on 03 February 2016 - 04:55 AM said:
It's exciting to think of all of the possibilities though. We've been wanting to tackle a more advanced OS with a pretty GUI, actual file encryption and security etc. CraftOS 2.0 is exciting, it will actually bring that possibility to the table.

All of that is already possible though. Exerro's Phoenix OS has a nice GUI and encryption too.

FUNCTION MAN! #621

FUNCTION MAN!'s profile picture

429 posts

Posted 06 February 2016 - 05:34 PM

Creator, on 31 January 2016 - 05:21 AM said:
I meant that in the CC bios load is modified so that binaries cannot be loaded.

Well, it's modified so that binaries can't be loaded..

But It's a bad modification. It just errors if you try to call it with mode='b', regardless of contents.

Creator #622

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 06 February 2016 - 08:14 PM

Would binaries allow someone to break out of the sandbox?

apemanzilla #623

apemanzilla's profile picture

1610 posts

Posted 06 February 2016 - 08:29 PM

Creator, on 06 February 2016 - 08:14 PM said:
Would binaries allow someone to break out of the sandbox?

No, binary loading loads the string as Lua bytecode instead of Lua code.

It actually will load either as long as you pass nil or "t", despite "b" being disabled.

FUNCTION MAN! #624

FUNCTION MAN!'s profile picture

429 posts

Posted 06 February 2016 - 11:00 PM

apemanzilla, on 06 February 2016 - 08:29 PM said:
Creator, on 06 February 2016 - 08:14 PM said:
Would binaries allow someone to break out of the sandbox?

No, binary loading loads the string as Lua bytecode instead of Lua code.

It actually will load either as long as you pass nil or "t", despite "b" being disabled.

Or if you pass "bananas". It's a == check.

cyanisaac #625

cyanisaac's profile picture

385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 07 February 2016 - 12:46 AM

apemanzilla, on 06 February 2016 - 08:29 PM said:
Creator, on 06 February 2016 - 08:14 PM said:
Would binaries allow someone to break out of the sandbox?

No, binary loading loads the string as Lua bytecode instead of Lua code.

It actually will load either as long as you pass nil or "t", despite "b" being disabled.

What's bad about Lua bytecode though?

apemanzilla #626

apemanzilla's profile picture

1610 posts

Posted 07 February 2016 - 01:26 AM

cyanisaac, on 07 February 2016 - 12:46 AM said:
apemanzilla, on 06 February 2016 - 08:29 PM said:
Creator, on 06 February 2016 - 08:14 PM said:
Would binaries allow someone to break out of the sandbox?

No, binary loading loads the string as Lua bytecode instead of Lua code.

It actually will load either as long as you pass nil or "t", despite "b" being disabled.

What's bad about Lua bytecode though?

Absolutely nothing. Creator was under the impression that it would allow users to escape the sandbox, but it doesn't. It's just another form of Lua code.

SquidDev #627

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 07 February 2016 - 09:21 AM

apemanzilla, on 07 February 2016 - 01:26 AM said:
cyanisaac, on 07 February 2016 - 12:46 AM said:
What's bad about Lua bytecode though?

Absolutely nothing. Creator was under the impression that it would allow users to escape the sandbox, but it doesn't. It's just another form of Lua code.

IIRC there is a lack of verification in the C implementation of the Lua VM which means you can access locals outside your function. However no such bugs exist in the LuaJ implementation.

Creeper9207 #628

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 08 February 2016 - 04:11 PM

Someone tell the skype team at microsoft!

Bomb Bloke #629

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 09 February 2016 - 01:28 AM

Context.

To be fair, it does sound like the sort of thing you could wrap a loading screen around, but on the other hand it also sounds like the sort of thing where you shouldn't have to resort to browsing through bug reports to determine the cause of the behaviour.

Creeper9207 #630

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 05 March 2016 - 01:37 AM

New grain! :D/>

Edited on 05 March 2016 - 12:38 AM

wilcomega #631

wilcomega's profile picture

453 posts

Location Holland

Posted 05 March 2016 - 04:11 PM

how much time was in between the first and the second, and the second and the third? maybe we can estimate a release date! or whatever its couting down to

Konlab #632

779 posts

Location Kerbin

Posted 20 March 2016 - 09:01 AM

wilcomega, on 05 March 2016 - 04:11 PM said:
how much time was in between the first and the second, and the second and the third? maybe we can estimate a release date! or whatever its couting down to

~2 months = Something will happen ~14 months later.

Creator #633

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 20 March 2016 - 07:37 PM

Konlab, on 20 March 2016 - 09:01 AM said:
wilcomega, on 05 March 2016 - 04:11 PM said:
how much time was in between the first and the second, and the second and the third? maybe we can estimate a release date! or whatever its couting down to
~2 months = Something will happen ~14 months later.

I think that it should be a bit faster. Not saying your guess is wrong, just HOPING it is.

Elttob #634

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 03 April 2016 - 04:06 PM

16 colours are definitely enough to work with.

I present to you this palette:

It contains 6 shades of grey, 6 shades of any colour (in this case r=0, g=0, b=255), black, white, and one colour spare (useful if you want a close button on an operating system.)
Very useful for any anti-aliasing you may want to do; I used it on the back button in the images below, but I could've done it for all the text too.

Here's a few examples of different colours on an interface:

Konlab #635

779 posts

Location Kerbin

Posted 03 April 2016 - 07:03 PM

Creator, on 20 March 2016 - 07:37 PM said:
Konlab, on 20 March 2016 - 09:01 AM said:
wilcomega, on 05 March 2016 - 04:11 PM said:
how much time was in between the first and the second, and the second and the third? maybe we can estimate a release date! or whatever its couting down to
~2 months = Something will happen ~14 months later.

I think that it should be a bit faster. Not saying your guess is wrong, just HOPING it is.

One year is not a long time, I also hope that CC for minecraft eventually gets diamond computers that run CO 2.0.

H4X0RZ #636

H4X0RZ's profile picture

1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 03 April 2016 - 09:29 PM

Konlab, on 03 April 2016 - 07:03 PM said:
Creator, on 20 March 2016 - 07:37 PM said:
Konlab, on 20 March 2016 - 09:01 AM said:
wilcomega, on 05 March 2016 - 04:11 PM said:
how much time was in between the first and the second, and the second and the third? maybe we can estimate a release date! or whatever its couting down to
~2 months = Something will happen ~14 months later.

I think that it should be a bit faster. Not saying your guess is wrong, just HOPING it is.
One year is not a long time, I also hope that CC for minecraft eventually gets diamond computers that run CO 2.0.

But what is it isn't written in Java?

SquidDev #637

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 03 April 2016 - 10:01 PM

H4X0RZ, on 03 April 2016 - 09:29 PM said:
But what is it isn't written in Java?

I can't find the tweet, but I'm pretty sure it is using .Net instead of Java.

Edit: Found it

SquidDev, on 07 January 2016 - 09:01 PM said:
No "new features", but some interesting implementation detail: these three tweets suggest there is some .Net/C/Lua interop going on, which implies that the core is written in .Net, with a conventional Lua VM (rather than a pure Java or .Net implementation). If its written in .Net there might be some scope for plugins, but we will have to see :)/>.

Much later edit:
Also this recent tweet

Edited on 31 May 2016 - 06:05 AM

Bomb Bloke #638

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 03 April 2016 - 10:15 PM

Elttob, on 03 April 2016 - 04:06 PM said:
It contains 6 shades of grey, 6 shades of any colour (in this case r=0, g=0, b=255), black, white, and one colour spare (useful if you want a close button on an operating system.)

Doesn't that only account for fifteen colours?

Elttob #639

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 04 April 2016 - 09:37 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 03 April 2016 - 10:15 PM said:
Elttob, on 03 April 2016 - 04:06 PM said:
It contains 6 shades of grey, 6 shades of any colour (in this case r=0, g=0, b=255), black, white, and one colour spare (useful if you want a close button on an operating system.)

Doesn't that only account for fifteen colours?

Looking at it now, you're right! But that's not a bad thing; it's better than going over the limit :P/>

Elttob #640

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 04 April 2016 - 10:14 AM

Back again with another example to show you the power of antialiasing. Notice how few colours you need to do it!

EDIT: Wow, nobody's here! I'll just throw out another mock up of an antialiased interface. The text was.. interesting but I did it with only 8 colours.

Edited on 06 April 2016 - 02:23 PM

Creeper9207 #641

Creeper9207's profile picture

224 posts

Posted 10 April 2016 - 04:26 PM

YES!

wilcomega #642

wilcomega's profile picture

453 posts

Location Holland

Posted 13 April 2016 - 04:56 PM

question, is COs still going to run as a minecraft mod on in game computers, i am getting cofused now

Lupus590 #643

Lupus590's profile picture

2427 posts

Location UK

Posted 13 April 2016 - 05:46 PM

wilcomega, on 13 April 2016 - 04:56 PM said:
question, is COs still going to run as a minecraft mod on in game computers, i am getting cofused now

craftOS for CC (the MC mod) is still going to be a thing but it is not going to have the features which craftOS 2 is adding. These extra features (and craftOS 2 itself) are going to be released as a separate program, not affiliated with MineCraft in any way other than sharing a name and some features with the craftOS in CC.

Some people, such as myself, hope that one day some of the craftOS 2 features will make it into the MC mod. If I recall correctly, dan200 hasn't made any promises on being able to do this, but hasn't said no yet either.

Edited on 13 April 2016 - 03:48 PM

oeed #644

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 15 May 2016 - 03:34 AM

Because of the rollback I'll post the last two for archival sake I guess.

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/730317976193355776

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/730428457704947712

But, this is new, it's showing actual notes! I'd assume/hope that the crackling is just from the microphone not the actual sound output :P/>

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/731122769337946112

SquidDev #645

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 22 May 2016 - 05:21 PM

Arduino support on CraftOS

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/734410885268185088

MKlegoman357 #646

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 22 May 2016 - 05:27 PM

Also, looks like the OS is called CraftOS 2.0, but the game is CCNext. Or not. :D/>

Bomb Bloke #647

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 27 May 2016 - 01:17 PM

The sand moved again a day or two ago, albeit just a little.

RatcheT2497 #648

289 posts

Location Slovakia

Posted 27 May 2016 - 03:54 PM

Dan did a demo of the new CC on-stream
He apparently wants to do another one at a later date, so you should watch his streams :)/>

Just fyi :)/>

Lego Stax #649

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 30 May 2016 - 05:29 PM

I thought that I'd bring this to everyone's attention. :)/>

Spoiler

H4X0RZ #650

H4X0RZ's profile picture

1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 30 May 2016 - 07:31 PM

Lego Stax, on 30 May 2016 - 05:29 PM said:
I thought that I'd bring this to everyone's attention. :)/>

Spoiler

Is it approved that the sand is linked to CC? Maybe he's just counting up to his birthday or something…

jaketheraven #651

jaketheraven's profile picture

3 posts

Posted 30 May 2016 - 11:23 PM

Will CraftOS 2.0 be standalone, CC or both? Because people are saying it's either standalone or both, and if it is standalone, I just don't see the point of it. I mean, yes it will be fun to use and make lua programs on, but why do you need it? If it is standalone, it doesn't bring anything to us. In minecraft, you have these amazing computers that do redstoney stuff and private communication without commands and all that good stuff. But standalone? You make these programs and then what happens? Nobody uses them. Because who needs it? They don't need them to enhance their minecraft experience and they definitely don't bring anything to the REAL computer world. You make programs for no reason and they go nowhere. They don't contribute to anything even if it is entertainment. Even Oeed said on his PearOS page that he made that OS because no one that he was playing minecraft with him knew how to use the computers. I just really hope this is a mod update and not a standalone app or even both. Because before I saw everyone talking about how it's probably standalone, I was really excited about the MOD update.

H4X0RZ #652

H4X0RZ's profile picture

1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 31 May 2016 - 05:06 AM

jaketheraven, on 30 May 2016 - 11:23 PM said:
Will CraftOS 2.0 be standalone, CC or both? Because people are saying it's either standalone or both, and if it is standalone, I just don't see the point of it. I mean, yes it will be fun to use and make lua programs on, but why do you need it? If it is standalone, it doesn't bring anything to us. In minecraft, you have these amazing computers that do redstoney stuff and private communication without commands and all that good stuff. But standalone? You make these programs and then what happens? Nobody uses them. Because who needs it? They don't need them to enhance their minecraft experience and they definitely don't bring anything to the REAL computer world. You make programs for no reason and they go nowhere. They don't contribute to anything even if it is entertainment. Even Oeed said on his PearOS page that he made that OS because no one that he was playing minecraft with him knew how to use the computers. I just really hope this is a mod update and not a standalone app or even both. Because before I saw everyone talking about how it's probably standalone, I was really excited about the MOD update.

There are many use cases for this outside of CC. Java is slow and limits you. Thanks to the standalone we can build bigger and better games. And that is what it seems to be. A game engine. Although you can make everything you want, technically.

vico #653

76 posts

Location -

Posted 31 May 2016 - 07:47 AM

I'm really worried about all these speculations. Why mess with something that already works well?

I see in the start of the thread people hypothesizing about the removal of turtles. Personally, to me, that would be the end of the line. My main use of the mod in friend survival coop is the turtles. Even in creative, the little bastards can do something more quickly (and simultaneously) than a single human player.

About the chunk unloading thing (a limitation of Minecraft): see Chunky Peripherals or any other Chunk Loader (i'm currently using Simple Chunkloader for 1.8.9 because Chicken Bones give up to ChickenChunks for 1.8.9 in favor of 1.9 versions) while this doesn't update (i'm really waiting for a update). It does the "keep chunks" work well done. About "lack of persistence of lua scripts", seriously, labels are there for something, right?

If dan wants to create a possible game engine or something bigger, ok, but i hope ComputerCraft, as we know it, remain. Even just a port, with no enhancements, for future versions.

SquidDev #654

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 31 May 2016 - 08:01 AM

Note: A lot of what is posted in this post (and a lot of the topic) is speculation/conjecture.

vico, on 31 May 2016 - 07:47 AM said:
I'm really worried about all these speculations. Why mess with something that already works well?

One thing Dan has confirmed though is that this is not ComputerCraft as such. From what we can tell this is a whole new project which happens to share the look and feel of ComputerCraft but not its code. Craft OS 2.0 (or CCvNext as it also appears to be called) will be a stand alone application

vico, on 31 May 2016 - 07:47 AM said:
I see in the start of the thread people hypothesizing about the removal of turtles. Personally, to me, that would be the end of the line. My main use of the mod in friend survival coop is the turtles. Even in creative, the little bastards can do something more quickly (and simultaneously) than a single human player.

I don't think Dan plans on stopping normal ComputerCraft development any time soon. One of the things Dan is very passionate about is getting people coding and automating Minecraft worlds is an engaging way of doing this (CCEdu makes this even easier). CraftOS 2.0 seems to focus much more on game development rather than automation. However, due to the limitations of the Minecraft engine, decent graphics aren't easily achievable in CC and so a separate application has to be made.

vico, on 31 May 2016 - 07:47 AM said:
If dan wants to create a possible game engine or something bigger, ok, but i hope ComputerCraft, as we know it, remain. Even just a port, with no enhancements, for future versions.

I'm sure ComputerCraft development will continue, even if at a slower pace.

vico #655

76 posts

Location -

Posted 31 May 2016 - 09:18 AM

Thank you for the answers SquidDev

Bomb Bloke #656

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 31 May 2016 - 09:38 AM

SquidDev, on 31 May 2016 - 08:01 AM said:
From what we can tell this is a whole new project which happens to share the look and feel of ComputerCraft but not its code.

Well, not all the code, anyways.

jaketheraven, on 30 May 2016 - 11:23 PM said:
But standalone? You make these programs and then what happens? Nobody uses them. Because who needs it?

I've got a hunch that Dan might have something up his sleeve to encourage distribution. What if you could, for example, run them through a browser plugin?

(Granted, we can already do that with regular ComputerCraft scripts via Mimic, but Mimic's out of date and ComputerCraft scripts have a lot of limitations that're only worth putting up with within a Minecraft world.)

oeed #657

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 31 May 2016 - 10:12 AM

jaketheraven, on 30 May 2016 - 11:23 PM said:
Will CraftOS 2.0 be standalone, CC or both? Because people are saying it's either standalone or both, and if it is standalone, I just don't see the point of it. I mean, yes it will be fun to use and make lua programs on, but why do you need it? If it is standalone, it doesn't bring anything to us. In minecraft, you have these amazing computers that do redstoney stuff and private communication without commands and all that good stuff. But standalone? You make these programs and then what happens? Nobody uses them. Because who needs it? They don't need them to enhance their minecraft experience and they definitely don't bring anything to the REAL computer world. You make programs for no reason and they go nowhere. They don't contribute to anything even if it is entertainment. Even Oeed said on his PearOS page that he made that OS because no one that he was playing minecraft with him knew how to use the computers. I just really hope this is a mod update and not a standalone app or even both. Because before I saw everyone talking about how it's probably standalone, I was really excited about the MOD update.

You do raise a good point, although it's basically the same reason I gave up developing for CC. Ultimately you just have to come to terms with the fact that it's just a hobby I think. I'm strongly considering whether it'd be remotely possible to change for CC 2.0 software, but I do doubt it somewhat.

Edited on 31 May 2016 - 08:13 AM

Lupus590 #658

Lupus590's profile picture

2427 posts

Location UK

Posted 31 May 2016 - 10:56 AM

Its going to make the forums interesting to have programs/games designed for this project. I'm kind of glad that it won't have turtles, I probably would delay Hive until CC2 is out so I could target that instead.

Edited on 31 May 2016 - 08:56 AM

Waitdev_ #659

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 08 June 2016 - 11:36 AM

Dan200 just started streaming, and in the chat I saw this:

It's double confirmed :D/>

oeed #660

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 08 June 2016 - 10:23 PM

Waitdev_, on 08 June 2016 - 11:36 AM said:
Dan200 just started streaming, and in the chat I saw this:

It's double confirmed :D/>

I assume that "close to release now" refers to Redirection?

vico #661

76 posts

Location -

Posted 09 June 2016 - 02:31 AM

Lupus590, on 31 May 2016 - 10:56 AM said:
Its going to make the forums interesting to have programs/games designed for this project. I'm kind of glad that it won't have turtles, I probably would delay Hive until CC2 is out so I could target that instead.

:angry:/> :angry:/> :angry:/>

Waitdev_, on 08 June 2016 - 11:36 AM said:
Dan200 just started streaming, and in the chat I saw this:

It's double confirmed :D/>

oeed, on 08 June 2016 - 10:23 PM said:
I assume that "close to release now" refers to Redirection?

Hi hope all the fuzz is about Redirection.
ComputerCraft cant die.

dan200 #662

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 09 June 2016 - 12:03 PM

ComputerCraft won't die. CCNext is a seperate thing (as is Redirection)

LewisTehMinerz #663

LewisTehMinerz's profile picture

223 posts

Location Minecraft in Minecraft in Minecraft in ComputerCraft... in Minecraft

Posted 09 June 2016 - 12:27 PM

Just wondering, is there going to be beta releases or an estimated release date?

CrazedProgrammer #664

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 09 June 2016 - 12:35 PM

Nice!
Can't wait to play around with the new features :D/>

Waitdev_ #665

Waitdev_'s profile picture

818 posts

Location Wherever you want me to be

Posted 09 June 2016 - 01:24 PM

dan200, on 09 June 2016 - 12:03 PM said:
ComputerCraft won't die. CCNext is a seperate thing (as is Redirection)

Wait, CCNext? Is that actually what CraftOS 2.0 is called? I must have missed something!

Bomb Bloke #666

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 09 June 2016 - 01:30 PM

Last we saw, yes, that's the name.

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/734410885268185088

DesertEagle-2000 #667

37 posts

Location The Netherlands

Posted 09 June 2016 - 03:18 PM

~Removed comment~

Edited on 09 June 2016 - 01:29 PM

dan200 #668

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 09 June 2016 - 03:56 PM

Bomb Bloke, on 09 June 2016 - 01:30 PM said:
Last we saw, yes, that's the name.

https://twitter.com/...410885268185088

To be more accurate: the project as a whole doesn't have a name yet, CCNext is my codename until I think of one. CraftOS 2.0 is the name of the default operating system.

vico #669

76 posts

Location -

Posted 09 June 2016 - 04:09 PM

Oh i see. Porting CraftOS to Adruino/Raspberry Pi.

H4X0RZ #670

H4X0RZ's profile picture

1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 09 June 2016 - 09:49 PM

vico, on 09 June 2016 - 04:09 PM said:
Oh i see. Porting CraftOS to Adruino/Raspberry Pi.

Nope. CraftOS will be able to send messages to Arduinos though.

Bomb Bloke #671

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 13 June 2016 - 08:48 AM

The hourglass has moved again, and Dan's talking about porting CC to MC 1.9.4:

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/741955876911779840

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/742107377638465536

oeed #672

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 13 June 2016 - 09:17 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 13 June 2016 - 08:48 AM said:
The hourglass has moved again.

Based on how progress on Redirection seems to be going, I'd actually bet that it's about that, rather than CCNext.

CrazedProgrammer #673

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 13 June 2016 - 01:48 PM

Bomb Bloke, on 13 June 2016 - 08:48 AM said:
The hourglass has moved again, and Dan's talking about porting CC to MC 1.9.4:
https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/741955876911779840
https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/742107377638465536

Wow, Minecraft is already at version 1.9.4.

Bomb Bloke #674

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 13 June 2016 - 01:51 PM

1.10, actually, as of a few days ago.

http://minecraft.gamepedia.com/Frostburn_Update

KnightMiner #675

KnightMiner's profile picture

187 posts

Location attempt to index "location" (a nil value)

Posted 13 June 2016 - 03:31 PM

No Forge on 1.10 though, I think they plan on waiting a few versions as the next couple updates are supposed to be quick

vico #676

76 posts

Location -

Posted 16 June 2016 - 09:34 AM

KnightMiner, on 13 June 2016 - 03:31 PM said:
No Forge on 1.10 though, I think they plan on waiting a few versions as the next couple updates are supposed to be quick

In fact Lex is already working on it…

LexManos said:
I've finished the MCP 1.10 update it's now just sitting there waiting of Searge/Bspkrs to take a look at it.
Once they push that out i'll start working on 1.10 Forge.

Edited on 16 June 2016 - 07:36 AM

CrazedProgrammer #677

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 16 June 2016 - 12:47 PM

Holy *, Minecraft is already at version 1.10?
I feel old, and I only started at beta 1.7.3 :P/>

dan200 #678

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 16 June 2016 - 01:08 PM

CrazedProgrammer, on 16 June 2016 - 12:47 PM said:
Holy *, Minecraft is already at version 1.10?
I feel old, and I only started at beta 1.7.3 :P/>

Alpha 1.1.0 here!

CrazedProgrammer #679

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 16 June 2016 - 01:13 PM

dan200 said:
Alpha 1.1.0 here!

Nice :)/>

KnightMiner #680

KnightMiner's profile picture

187 posts

Location attempt to index "location" (a nil value)

Posted 16 June 2016 - 01:57 PM

I started Release 1.6.4, so it does not make me feel that old

Edit: I cannot remember numbers good…

Edited on 16 June 2016 - 09:24 PM

LDDestroier #681

LDDestroier's profile picture

1715 posts

Location ACDC Town

Posted 16 June 2016 - 03:41 PM

I started at 1.0 final version. I didn't start with the beta or alpha…

caza1112 #682

caza1112's profile picture

14 posts

Posted 26 June 2016 - 02:20 AM

If i remember right i started on version 1.2.3 or something :')

Konlab #683

779 posts

Location Kerbin

Posted 26 June 2016 - 07:32 AM

The online classic version here

Elttob #684

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 26 June 2016 - 10:06 AM

I started at Beta 1.3_01 :P/>

Anyway, I felt inspired by Silica and decided I may as well try my hand at an operating system for COS 2.0. I had one in mind for a long time anyway, and if I didn't make it here, I would have made it for regular CC. I figured if Silica was like a Mac, then I may as well make a Windows 7.

I made an album with my UI mockups I made. It also contains a comparison between my UI and Silica's UI. The font is a work in progress though; right now it's using 04b03 (freeware font) but I'm making a modified version which is less 'sharp' but retains the same clarity.
http://imgur.com/a/zHyPE

I've already played around with the limitations before - in fact the UI mockups I posted here earlier (including the one with anti aliasing :D/>) were actually early versions of my OS concept. I eventually decided against the mobile-like theme though (as well as the idea that applications could only use 1 colour; that would suck!) and started thinking up alternative designs. This is the one I liked the best.

If there's anything to be improved then do tell me; after all, it's a work in progress!

Edited on 26 June 2016 - 08:27 AM

Creator #685

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 26 June 2016 - 10:24 AM

Elttob, on 26 June 2016 - 10:06 AM said:
I started at Beta 1.3_01 :P/>

Anyway, I felt inspired by Silica and decided I may as well try my hand at an operating system for COS 2.0. I had one in mind for a long time anyway, and if I didn't make it here, I would have made it for regular CC. I figured if Silica was like a Mac, then I may as well make a Windows 7.

I made an album with my UI mockups I made. It also contains a comparison between my UI and Silica's UI. The font is a work in progress though; right now it's using 04b03 (freeware font) but I'm making a modified version which is less 'sharp' but retains the same clarity.
http://imgur.com/a/dqAhp

I've already played around with the limitations before - in fact the UI mockups I posted here earlier (including the one with anti aliasing :D/>) were actually early versions of my OS concept. I eventually decided against the mobile-like theme though (as well as the idea that applications could only use 1 colour; that would suck!) and started thinking up alternative designs. This is the one I liked the best.

If there's anything to be improved then do tell me; after all, it's a work in progress!

Whoa dude, that's like seriously awesome!

Congrats!

Now you need the code :P/>

oeed #686

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 26 June 2016 - 11:03 AM

Elttob, on 26 June 2016 - 10:06 AM said:
–snip–

I've gotta say, that's pretty impressive! You know I'd never really thought/intended for Silica to be 'Mac like', although with that comparison it's pretty obvious haha. You really nailed the Windows 7 look!

Edited on 26 June 2016 - 09:04 AM

Elttob #687

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 27 June 2016 - 05:28 PM

Creator, on 26 June 2016 - 10:24 AM said:
Elttob, on 26 June 2016 - 10:06 AM said:
–snip–
Whoa dude, that's like seriously awesome!
Congrats!
Now you need the code :P/>/>/>/>/>

oeed, on 26 June 2016 - 11:03 AM said:
Elttob, on 26 June 2016 - 10:06 AM said:
–snip–
I've gotta say, that's pretty impressive! You know I'd never really thought/intended for Silica to be 'Mac like', although with that comparison it's pretty obvious haha. You really nailed the Windows 7 look!

Thanks! I've been working on it a ton, making it look as polished as possible. I've redone every single icon (except the Favourites icon), changed the window borders a bit to add more depth, shrunk down the window buttons a small bit, changed the start button to be an ^ arrow, changed the desktop icon too (text, shortcut symbol, and ofc the icon itself), changed the shading on the show desktop button and removed shading from the active window icon on the taskbar, added file sizes to the file explorer window, also added the current folder name to the title bar, changed the padding and inactive colour on the title bar too, and made a nicer background!

*gasps for air*

I'm looking forward to seeing the other operating systems other people create on COS2.0, there's so much potential for creativity and I am more than satisfied! Also, if you want it, here's my optimised colour palette:

CrazedProgrammer #688

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 27 June 2016 - 06:17 PM

Very cool!
Does adventure take 42GB? :P/>

Creator #689

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 27 June 2016 - 06:46 PM

Elttob, on 27 June 2016 - 05:28 PM said:
Creator, on 26 June 2016 - 10:24 AM said:
Elttob, on 26 June 2016 - 10:06 AM said:
–snip–
Whoa dude, that's like seriously awesome!
Congrats!
Now you need the code :P/>/>/>/>/>

oeed, on 26 June 2016 - 11:03 AM said:
Elttob, on 26 June 2016 - 10:06 AM said:
–snip–
I've gotta say, that's pretty impressive! You know I'd never really thought/intended for Silica to be 'Mac like', although with that comparison it's pretty obvious haha. You really nailed the Windows 7 look!

Thanks! I've been working on it a ton, making it look as polished as possible. I've redone every single icon (except the Favourites icon), changed the window borders a bit to add more depth, shrunk down the window buttons a small bit, changed the start button to be an ^ arrow, changed the desktop icon too (text, shortcut symbol, and ofc the icon itself), changed the shading on the show desktop button and removed shading from the active window icon on the taskbar, added file sizes to the file explorer window, also added the current folder name to the title bar, changed the padding and inactive colour on the title bar too, and made a nicer background!

*gasps for air*

I'm looking forward to seeing the other operating systems other people create on COS2.0, there's so much potential for creativity and I am more than satisfied! Also, if you want it, here's my optimised colour palette:

Тоо many window explorer icons. You need Clover.

Elttob #690

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 27 June 2016 - 08:57 PM

CrazedProgrammer, on 27 June 2016 - 06:17 PM said:
Very cool!
Does adventure take 42GB? :P/>

No, that's just for show. Did you know that 42 ÷ 2 = 21?

Creator, on 27 June 2016 - 06:46 PM said:
Elttob, on 27 June 2016 - 05:28 PM said:
Creator, on 26 June 2016 - 10:24 AM said:
Elttob, on 26 June 2016 - 10:06 AM said:
–snip–
Whoa dude, that's like seriously awesome!
Congrats!
Now you need the code :P/>/>/>/>/>

oeed, on 26 June 2016 - 11:03 AM said:
Elttob, on 26 June 2016 - 10:06 AM said:
–snip–
I've gotta say, that's pretty impressive! You know I'd never really thought/intended for Silica to be 'Mac like', although with that comparison it's pretty obvious haha. You really nailed the Windows 7 look!

Thanks! I've been working on it a ton, making it look as polished as possible. I've redone every single icon (except the Favourites icon), changed the window borders a bit to add more depth, shrunk down the window buttons a small bit, changed the start button to be an ^ arrow, changed the desktop icon too (text, shortcut symbol, and ofc the icon itself), changed the shading on the show desktop button and removed shading from the active window icon on the taskbar, added file sizes

Тоо many window explorer icons. You need Clover.

Yeah lol. I'll add the group thingamajig to the actual OS ( in other words, [π] –> [π]] ) so there's less going on down in the taskbar.

Elttob #691

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 04 July 2016 - 07:29 PM

Oh wow, this thread has gone quiet. It's been a solid week.

I've only the media player design concept to show, and this will probably be the last I post of Vertex OS for a while. I was playing with individual pixels for this one!

(That's Vertex's logo in the video player! Mintysoft isn't real though, I just put it there because it looked cool and like the old Microsoft logo.)

But we need a standard video format for COS2.0, please do submit your ideas to the CraftOS Specifications repository that was set up somewhere. I forgot who made it or where the link is ;-;

oeed #692

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 05 July 2016 - 07:53 AM

Elttob, on 04 July 2016 - 07:29 PM said:
I forgot who made it or where the link is ;-;

https://github.com/oeed/CraftOS-Standards ;)/>

LeDark Lua #693

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 06 July 2016 - 06:54 PM

Hey y'all, I started at that Internet version of Minecraft :P/> I dunno what version it was, but I think it's the earliest :P/>

jv110 #694

jv110's profile picture

254 posts

Location In front of my PC

Posted 06 July 2016 - 07:03 PM

The first version wasn't even Minecraft.

I don't remember where I started. I think it was 1.8/1.8.1 beta or something, but since updates were released so fast at the time, I'm not very sure.

Edited on 06 July 2016 - 07:43 PM

LDDestroier #695

LDDestroier's profile picture

1715 posts

Location ACDC Town

Posted 06 July 2016 - 07:59 PM

LeDark Lua, on 06 July 2016 - 06:54 PM said:
Hey y'all, I started at that Internet version of Minecraft :P/> I dunno what version it was, but I think it's the earliest :P/>

I think it was called 'classic'.

thecrimulo #696

111 posts

Location here

Posted 06 July 2016 - 10:21 PM

Please, just tell me someone will make an OS customizable enough to be like Linux. Those fancy ricings with tiling and WMs/DEs and urxvt…. By now, I'm working on a Windows manager, fully customizable, coloring, redraws… BUT, its a Window Manager, it won't use GUIs, or buttons or bars… The concept idea is just to make 3 objects, Windows, Menus and Bars. Window objects are already in development and consist of Panel, Border and Decorator. The wm is going to be called furwm. The power of it will be something like this

Those are the possibilities of no border and no offset in decorator. However, the idea is not to have it being my default desktop, but let it have frames for the GUI. Silica and Vertex are extremely well, and will be the bestest by far. But you know, a different way of implementing it would be cool. I think GUIs, Window Managers and Desktop Environments are being a bit privatised, they look pretty much like Mac and Windows, but I recommend you a visit thru /r/unixporn. There, users like me rice it's computer like they want, and there are no limitations, I can get Ubuntu, change the applications, WM and DE, and all the programs to convert it to Linux Mint and thats what I mean by truly free customization. Tiling would be great, and stacking… We could do. for example, not draw the things and let users have its API so it looks like it, but loading images, users could just load a pallete, edit how they want the menu to look, or the decorators, anything. With the new resolution we have a new world and I don't like to limit users to what I'm offering them, Silica and Vertex are neat, I like them and probably use them, probably if i like them so much I'll make a bootloader that can boot into different OSes but things should be more open. I've also read about payment on licensed apps using… this currency I never heard about, and there exists this concept: FLOSS: Free/Libre Open Source Software. If you license your app, It's a lose-lose. Because even if I'm not really good at Lua, I can make my own free and open source alternative. But free in the two meanings. Free as in no money and free as in freedom. We have the ability to make flat interfaces, or gradient, antialiasing, shadows… and we have the ability to switch between them, too. I will start working on a GUI library as well, and I'll make my own interfaces and all. "But then all you said it was a lie you are doing the same" No. I'm making a library that you can use or not. In my dreamworld you can round and flatten decorator squares with a click and a refresh. Thank you dan for all this advancement.

I've just realized I've talked too much about FLOSS and KISS.

CrazedProgrammer #697

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 06 July 2016 - 10:48 PM

TL;DR :P/>

Just kidding, it looks really nice!
I'm wondering how the standard CraftOS 2.0 will be implemented and how popular these custom OSes and GUI frameworks will be.

Elttob #698

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 07 July 2016 - 07:38 AM

Vertex will support themes (like Windows but without all the patching stuffs)

DesertEagle-2000 #699

37 posts

Location The Netherlands

Posted 23 July 2016 - 10:29 AM

So Dan is working on a new thing called CCNext or CraftOS 2.0, well I heard that he doesn't have a name for the project yet.
So I thought, let's help him! Basicly the point of this topic is that you post a name that might fit the new project.
And since CraftOS 2.0 is kinda DOSish ;)/>, I thought of 'ComputerDos'. Do you think this is a good name? or do you prefer something else

DIES #700

DIES's profile picture

8 posts

Location Novorossia

Posted 23 July 2016 - 11:43 PM

DesertEagle-2000, on 23 July 2016 - 10:29 AM said:
…

I think "CraftOS 2" is good name for it. No need for changing.

H4X0RZ #701

H4X0RZ's profile picture

1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 24 July 2016 - 12:20 AM

DesertEagle&#045;2000, on 23 July 2016 - 10:29 AM said:
So Dan is working on a new thing called CCNext or CraftOS 2.0, well I heard that he doesn't have a name for the project yet.
So I thought, let's help him! Basicly the point of this topic is that you post a name that might fit the new project.
And since CraftOS 2.0 is kinda DOSish ;)/>/>, I thought of 'ComputerDos'. Do you think this is a good name? or do you prefer something else

So you want to call it "ComputerDiskOperatingSystem"? Sounds like repetitive and useless to me :/ IMO CCNext would be okay

thecrimulo #702

111 posts

Location here

Posted 24 July 2016 - 01:11 AM

I don't think it's DOS, more like, Unix shell. I support CCNext

oeed #703

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 24 July 2016 - 02:33 AM

If the mockups are anything to go by, ComputerCraft is way more 'DOS' like. We've got fancy graphics and sound now, that ain't DOS!

vico #704

76 posts

Location -

Posted 24 July 2016 - 09:36 AM

Anyway, I wonder if CC dev is still active.

Almost a month without any news…

Edited on 24 July 2016 - 07:36 AM

KingofGamesYami #705

3057 posts

Location United States of America

Posted 24 July 2016 - 01:24 PM

vico, on 24 July 2016 - 09:36 AM said:
Anyway, I wonder if CC dev is still active.
Almost a month without any news…

He's definitely active. Just not on this project - he's finishing Redirection. Just check out his twitter.

Lego Stax #706

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 03 August 2016 - 07:46 PM

Since it is clear that others have made concept art for what resembles Mac and Windows GUIs, I took it upon myself to make a picture of what the GNOME shell might look like.

I would also like to make a proposal. We should stick to a centralized list of commands for these different GUIs (Silica, Vertex, etc) that would allow CCNext programs to be interchangeable between them without having to have different code for different environments.

CrazedProgrammer #707

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 03 August 2016 - 09:22 PM

Lego Stax, on 03 August 2016 - 07:46 PM said:
snip

Wow that looks very cool!
It would indeed be nice if there were a standard for windowed programs, but as I see it now (from a couple tweets dan made some months ago) it's the same shell/multishell layout as standard CC.

Lego Stax #708

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 04 August 2016 - 03:08 AM

CrazedProgrammer, on 03 August 2016 - 09:22 PM said:
Lego Stax, on 03 August 2016 - 07:46 PM said:
snip

Wow that looks very cool!
It would indeed be nice if there were a standard for windowed programs, but as I see it now (from a couple tweets dan made some months ago) it's the same shell/multishell layout as standard CC.

Thanks! You misunderstand what I mean. What I meant was that the community should stick to a centralized set of commands for drawing to windows, and the developers of these different GUIs should provide that centralized set of commands across the board, as well as perhaps have extra commands for their environments. I don't really know how to explain it any better…

Emma #709

218 posts

Location tmpim

Posted 04 August 2016 - 05:03 AM

Lego Stax, on 04 August 2016 - 03:08 AM said:
the community should stick to a centralized set of commands for drawing to windows

If you want, you can propose a standard for this here

oeed #710

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 04 August 2016 - 06:16 AM

Lego Stax, on 04 August 2016 - 03:08 AM said:
CrazedProgrammer, on 03 August 2016 - 09:22 PM said:
Lego Stax, on 03 August 2016 - 07:46 PM said:
snip

Wow that looks very cool!
It would indeed be nice if there were a standard for windowed programs, but as I see it now (from a couple tweets dan made some months ago) it's the same shell/multishell layout as standard CC.

Thanks! You misunderstand what I mean. What I meant was that the community should stick to a centralized set of commands for drawing to windows, and the developers of these different GUIs should provide that centralized set of commands across the board, as well as perhaps have extra commands for their environments. I don't really know how to explain it any better…

I'm interested to know what you mean by this, could you maybe elaborate a bit further?

If it's what I think you're saying, I'm not sure how possible it'd be. Silica does everything (particularly interfaces) in quite a unique and highly abstracted way, but drawing might be possible. I'm interested to see how Dan's graphics API works.

Edited on 04 August 2016 - 06:10 PM

Bomb Bloke #711

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 04 August 2016 - 06:28 AM

I assume he's referring to something like the term API, which is standardised across the regular CC terminal, monitors, windows, and plenty of third-party buffers.

TheRockettek #712

726 posts

Location Rem is best girl

Posted 04 August 2016 - 07:06 AM

wut about PotatOS d:

Lego Stax #713

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 04 August 2016 - 05:45 PM

Incinirate, on 04 August 2016 - 05:03 AM said:
Lego Stax, on 04 August 2016 - 03:08 AM said:
-snip-
If you want, you can propose a standard for this here

I forgot about that. Thanks! I'll do it later today.
EDIT: Writing this markdown document is taking longer than I thought….it might be a couple days…

oeed, on 04 August 2016 - 06:16 AM said:
-snip-

I'm interested to know what you mean by this, could you maybe elaborate a bit further?

Like what Bomb Bloke said, what I mean is it would be nice to have a common API (or set of commands, whatever you want to call it) that every separate GUI framework shares (as there will probably be quite a few of them). This would allow a single coder to write their program to work properly with every GUI.
Basically, what I'm saying is that it would be nice for every GUI framework to be like XOrg in that they go as far as sharing the same commands for managing the screen or a window.
GUI frameworks could have other methods of displaying stuff outside of these commands as well, but every GUI would have to share this "common API/system".

I read a little bit into Silica's Github wiki, and I have no idea how something like this would be implemented…
But it sure would be nice.

Bomb Bloke, on 04 August 2016 - 06:28 AM said:
I assume he's referring to something like the term API.

This is what I mean. We'll have to wait to see what Dan's graphics API is like first.

Edited on 04 August 2016 - 11:58 PM

Elttob #714

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 07 August 2016 - 12:00 PM

I am not dead!

Also I wrote a Java program to convert png images to be CraftOS 2.0 compatible. Here's some themes I made for Vertex using this tech:

As far as compatibility goes, Vertex will be able to run CCNext programs through the command prompt, and also will have a reduced colours option to use the standard CCNext palette instead of Vertex's optimised palette:

Not very pretty.

Edited on 07 August 2016 - 03:36 PM

LeDark Lua #715

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 07 August 2016 - 07:23 PM

Wow Elttob, that looks hellah awesome!!

CrazedProgrammer #716

546 posts

Location Wageningen, The Netherlands

Posted 09 August 2016 - 01:52 AM

Wow Ettlob, that's extremely impressive!

TheRockettek #717

726 posts

Location Rem is best girl

Posted 09 August 2016 - 09:02 AM

Then just before releasing ccnet he adds:

term.setCursorPosRGB(r,g,B)/>
term.setBackgroundPosRGB(r,g,B)/>

\o/

LeDark Lua #718

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 09 August 2016 - 10:38 AM

TheRockettek why does the cursor have an RBG value instead of XY and why does background has a Pos?

thecrimulo #719

111 posts

Location here

Posted 09 August 2016 - 01:11 PM

Actually, making standards, would lead to a nicer WM/DE feel, and if OSes could easily switch or simply don't have one, that'd be great

MKlegoman357 #720

1140 posts

Location Kaunas, Lithuania

Posted 09 August 2016 - 05:19 PM

Lego Stax, on 04 August 2016 - 05:45 PM said:
Like what Bomb Bloke said, what I mean is it would be nice to have a common API (or set of commands, whatever you want to call it) that every separate GUI framework shares (as there will probably be quite a few of them). This would allow a single coder to write their program to work properly with every GUI.
Basically, what I'm saying is that it would be nice for every GUI framework to be like XOrg in that they go as far as sharing the same commands for managing the screen or a window.
GUI frameworks could have other methods of displaying stuff outside of these commands as well, but every GUI would have to share this "common API/system".

thecrimulo, on 09 August 2016 - 01:11 PM said:
Actually, making standards, would lead to a nicer WM/DE feel, and if OSes could easily switch or simply don't have one, that'd be great

The main standard for drawing pixels will already be there, no need to create one yourself. There actually doesn't need to be any standards for any programs by default, since there will still be something similar to the window API and everything will basically work like in CC. The only thing that programs will need to adapt to is the screen size and dynamic size changes (e.g.: window gets resized, a new CCNext-multishell tab is opened). This works with CC and windowed OSes already, if you make your program adapt to display resolution and listen for "term_resize" events. This way people won't need to search for any standard if they want to make their programs compatible with a windowed OS.

Where there should be a standard, is the actual window controls and properties: allow window to be resized/fixed size, change window's title, enable/disable close/maximize/minimize buttons, etc.. Also, for OSes with a desktop a drag'n'drop functionality would be fun (e.g.: dragging a file from your desktop to a messaging app).

Edited on 09 August 2016 - 03:20 PM

TheRockettek #721

726 posts

Location Rem is best girl

Posted 09 August 2016 - 07:13 PM

LeDark Lua, on 09 August 2016 - 10:38 AM said:
TheRockettek why does the cursor have an RBG value instead of XY and why does background has a Pos?

I am a derp and i actually meant colour not pos d:

Lego Stax #722

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 09 August 2016 - 08:53 PM

MKlegoman357, on 09 August 2016 - 05:19 PM said:
This works with CC and windowed OSes already, if you make your program adapt to display resolution and listen for "term_resize" events. This way people won't need to search for any standard if they want to make their programs compatible with a windowed OS.

I think you misunderstood what I was referring to. I'm talking about the GUI frameworks such as Silica. Silica is not a windowed OS. I'm talking about standard commands for these GUI frameworks to share such as commands to place buttons, write text with a certain font, loading bars, checkboxes, etc.

oeed #723

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 09 August 2016 - 09:11 PM

Lego Stax, on 09 August 2016 - 08:53 PM said:
MKlegoman357, on 09 August 2016 - 05:19 PM said:
This works with CC and windowed OSes already, if you make your program adapt to display resolution and listen for "term_resize" events. This way people won't need to search for any standard if they want to make their programs compatible with a windowed OS.

I think you misunderstood what I was referring to. I'm talking about the GUI frameworks such as Silica. Silica is not a windowed OS. I'm talking about standard commands for these GUI frameworks to share such as commands to place buttons, write text with a certain font, loading bars, checkboxes, etc.

I can't see that ever happening unfortunately. The way Silica programs are made is very different to most previous GUI frameworks. You don't/can't just call a function and have it add a button and then change a few properties. You need to use themes and subclass it. It might be possible to have some kind of program that can bridge between the two, but there won't be native support.

OS functions could probably be standardised though.

Lego Stax #724

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 09 August 2016 - 09:16 PM

oeed, on 09 August 2016 - 09:11 PM said:
I can't see that ever happening unfortunately. The way Silica programs are made is very different to most previous GUI frameworks. You don't/can't just call a function and have it add a button and then change a few properties. You need to use themes and subclass it. It might be possible to have some kind of program that can bridge between the two, but there won't be native support.

OS functions could probably be standardised though.

I wouldn't expect there to be support for that, since Silica is already written. But, once CCNext comes out, I would be willing to look into making a program/API that can bridge the two. I'll be reading more Silica documentation as I have time.

cyanisaac #725

cyanisaac's profile picture

385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 15 August 2016 - 08:08 PM

I see people talking about stuff being made for CraftOS 2.0, but I know it isn't out yet. How are people writing stuff for it? Is CraftOS 2.0 going to have the same API as CraftOS 1.0 or something?

Curious as someone who's got a lot of stuff he wants to write waiting on CraftOS 2.0 to come out. :P/>

oeed #726

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 15 August 2016 - 09:42 PM

cyanisaac, on 15 August 2016 - 08:08 PM said:
I see people talking about stuff being made for CraftOS 2.0, but I know it isn't out yet. How are people writing stuff for it? Is CraftOS 2.0 going to have the same API as CraftOS 1.0 or something?

Curious as someone who's got a lot of stuff he wants to write waiting on CraftOS 2.0 to come out. :P/>

I modified CCLite to have the smaller pixels. It doesn't have all/any of the new features, including the new graphics API, but it gives you can idea as to how it'll look like. The emulator I use is here and works just like CCLite in terms of adding programs. It hides characters though, so you will need to implement something which outputs print to a file.

ScoutCD10 #727

ScoutCD10's profile picture

18 posts

Posted 01 September 2016 - 12:04 PM

The hourglass moved again after almost 3 months!
And dan said on his twitter "Time Passes…"
CC2.0 soon?
I estimate that CC2.0 will come out in winter 2017..

Admicos #728

275 posts

Location Turkey

Posted 01 September 2016 - 12:21 PM

ScoutCD10, on 01 September 2016 - 12:04 PM said:
And dan said on his twitter "Time Passes…"

I possibly knew it would be related!

oeed #729

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 01 September 2016 - 09:08 PM

I'm actually pretty convinced that the countdown is for Redirection sadly.

Lego Stax #730

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 22 September 2016 - 10:39 PM

Do we know if Dan's going to support Linux?

TheRockettek #731

726 posts

Location Rem is best girl

Posted 23 September 2016 - 09:57 PM

Lego Stax, on 22 September 2016 - 10:39 PM said:
Do we know if Dan's going to support Linux?

Coz we have luv for linux…(But we hate mac)

Tbh these days linux is getting more noticed and is getting more widely popular

LeDark Lua #732

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 24 September 2016 - 05:39 PM

So wait, more about graphics… will CC2.0 have 16 rgb colors/tile or 16 rgb colors/tileset?

Bomb Bloke #733

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 24 September 2016 - 11:40 PM

Per screenpage, from what we've seen. Not sure what you mean by "tile", but if you're referring to the sprites Dan's shown, then 16 colours per one of those drawn would make the whole limitation a bit pointless.

LeDark Lua #734

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 26 September 2016 - 09:37 AM

Screenpage? Like i have two shells open one can be grayscale and another bluescale?

ScoutCD10 #735

ScoutCD10's profile picture

18 posts

Posted 11 October 2016 - 08:09 PM

An another pixel of dan's twitter hourglass picture moved!
3 pixels left!
And no,its not linked to Redirection because Dan submitted Redirection to Steam for approval yesterday

SquidDev #736

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 11 October 2016 - 08:45 PM

We know that Dan won't release the "secret project" til after Redirection is released. Also hype for redirection release - I really enjoyed the alpha so looking forward to playing the full game.

What do people make of this tweet (and the following tweets):

Belated #screenshotsaturday. Been working real hard addressing playtest feedback this week, so here's an older feature I haven't shown yet:

It's kind of an easter egg, but for reasons I won't elaborate yet: ComputerCraft fans will love it.

Consider this something of a preview for that project!

Creator #737

2679 posts

Location You will never find me, muhahahahahaha

Posted 11 October 2016 - 09:19 PM

SquidDev, on 11 October 2016 - 08:45 PM said:
We know that Dan won't release the "secret project" til after Redirection is released. Also hype for redirection release - I really enjoyed the alpha so looking forward to playing the full game.

What do people make of this tweet (and the following tweets):
Belated #screenshotsaturday. Been working real hard addressing playtest feedback this week, so here's an older feature I haven't shown yet:
It's kind of an easter egg, but for reasons I won't elaborate yet: ComputerCraft fans will love it.
Consider this something of a preview for that project!

Holy moly! This sounds great! Maybe CC in redirection, maybe!

Wojbie #738

724 posts

Location Kinda lost

Posted 13 October 2016 - 07:59 AM

Quote from: http://www.computerc...e-announcement/ for pepole who are not up to date.

As a special treat for ComputerCraft fans, I can also announce today that Redirection will contain a programmable “Robot Arcade” mode, where you’ll be able to play arcade mini-games on the Robots that you unlock while playing the main game, and create your own using Lua! Some of you may have noticed me talking on Twitter about something called CraftOS 2.0 recently, and you can think of this as a preview for that

Edited on 13 October 2016 - 06:00 AM

H4X0RZ #739

H4X0RZ's profile picture

1583 posts

Location Germany

Posted 13 October 2016 - 08:17 AM

Wojbie, on 13 October 2016 - 07:59 AM said:
Quote from: http://www.computerc...e-announcement/ for pepole who are not up to date.

As a special treat for ComputerCraft fans, I can also announce today that Redirection will contain a programmable “Robot Arcade” mode, where you’ll be able to play arcade mini-games on the Robots that you unlock while playing the main game, and create your own using Lua! Some of you may have noticed me talking on Twitter about something called CraftOS 2.0 recently, and you can think of this as a preview for that

Nice! But does this mean that adding "CraftOS 2.0" to Redirect was just to show off and COS 2.0 will get a proper release someday?

Edited on 13 October 2016 - 06:17 AM

TheRockettek #740

726 posts

Location Rem is best girl

Posted 13 October 2016 - 01:31 PM

Sadly they wouldnt add turtles and craftOS 2 to redirection, it was just hinting a new look for redirection :D/>/>

Also why would we need craftOS in redirection?

Lego Stax #741

149 posts

Location The dark depths of the web

Posted 13 October 2016 - 02:46 PM

How many people think CraftOS 2.0 will get released on December 24?

Anavrins #742

Anavrins's profile picture

756 posts

Posted 25 October 2016 - 07:03 AM

dan200, on 09 July 2015 - 02:32 PM said:
Status update on this thing: With ComputerCraftEdu out of the way, my current focus is on finishing the Steam release of Redirection. When that is done, this new project gets 100% of my attention :)/>/>/>

Redirection has been released, and another grain of sand fell.
The hype is real!

Edited on 25 October 2016 - 05:03 AM

dan200 #743

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 28 October 2016 - 12:50 AM

Hey all,

I've just finished documenting the Robot Arcade part of Redirection, which as you probably know my now, serves as a preview of the CraftOS 2.0 project:
http://steamcommunit...s/?id=788101089

There have already been several Arcade games posted to the workshop, on top of the 3 built into the game:
http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/browse/?appid=305760&&requiredtags%5B%5D=Arcade+Games

If you want to get in on the action, Redirection is currently 15% off on Steam :)/>
http://store.steampo....com/app/305760

On top of the CraftOS 2.0 preview, you also get a great puzzle game with 100% positive Steam reviews, and help me to pay my rent :P/>

oeed #744

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 28 October 2016 - 05:20 AM

Awesome!

For things like Silica which will need to manually draw their pixels, rather than using the GPU, what is the fastest way to draw the entire screen?

Is using drawImage faster than repeatedly calling drawPixel, or does drawImage just call drawPixel itself (like paintuils)?

dan200 #745

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 28 October 2016 - 09:09 AM

I can't think of any reason not to use the GPU for rendering, but yes: one gpu.drawImage call is much faster than hundreds of gpu.drawPixel calls. Calling image:write with a string argument is the faster way to upload pixels into an image en masse also.

CoderPuppy #746

CoderPuppy's profile picture

130 posts

Posted 28 October 2016 - 07:12 PM

Edit by Dan:
**snip**
Please don't reverse engineer or decompile my code. Redirection is a commercial game, and the code is copyrighted. I don't mind you documenting the undocumented Lua APIs, but recompiling my code or creating other code that links to it crosses a line. I put a lot of trust in the community by deciding not to obfuscate the code, please don't make me regret this.

Spoiler

`fs.open` is the same as `io.open`.
Binary file handles are now equivalent to normal ones, just without corruption of non-UTF-8 data.
Entirely new graphics system.
Sound support.
Memory limit, set at 1MB (not 1MiB) in the arcade, this applies to Lua and any native objects you create such as images or palettes.
Now using Lua 5.3.
All standard Lua APIs are available and unchanged.

Spoiler

combine(a, b : string) : string
copy(src, dest : string)
delete(path : string)
exists(path : string) : bool
find(wildcard : string) : [string]
getDir(path : string) : string
getExtension(path : string) : string - fs.getExtension('a.lua') = 'lua'
getModifiedTime(path : string) : float - seconds since 12:00:00 on January 1 0001 (0001-01-01T12:00:00.00)
getName(path : string) : string - fs.getName('a/b/c/d.lua') = 'd.lua'
getNameWithoutExtension(path : string) : string - fs.getNameWithoutExtension('a/b/c/d.e.lua') = 'd.e'
getSize(path : string) : int
isDir(path : string) : bool
isReadOnly(path : string) : bool
list(path : string) : [string]
makeDir(path : string)
match(path : string, wildcard : string) : bool - check if `path` matches `wildcard`
move(src, dst: string)
open(path : string, mode : string) : handle
getMount(path : string) : mount?
getMountLocations() : [string]
mount(mount : mount, path : string, subPath : string = '', readOnly : bool = true) - mount `mount`/`subPath` at `path`
unmount(path : string)
unmount(mount : mount)

Spoiler

alloc(size : int, fill : int = 0) : buffer
getDevice(name : string) : table
getDeviceDescription(name : string) : string
getDevicesNames() : [string]
getDeviceType(name : string) : string
getGUID() : string
getPowerStatus() : string, int - `powerStatus, chargeLevel`, `powerStatus` is either `'unpowered'`, `'charged'`, `'charging'`, `'discharging'` or `'fixed'`
getFreeMemory() : int
getTotalMemory() : int
queueEvent(name : string, …)
reboot()
shutdown()
pullEvent(filters : string*) : string, …
pullEventRaw(filters : string* : string, …
sleep(seconds : int)

Spoiler

copy() : buffer
fill(fill : int)
fill(fill : int, start : int, length : int)
len() : int
read(pos : int) : int
read(start : int, length : int) : string
sub(start : int, length : int = self:len() - start) : buffer
write(pos : int, value : int)
write(start : int, value : string)

Spoiler

getClock() : int - number of seconds the computer has been running
getTime() : float - time as seconds since 12:00:00 January 1 0001 (0001-01-01T12:00:00.00)
resetTime() - reset the time to UTC
setTime(time : float)
setAlarm(time : float): int
cancelAlarm(id : int)
startTimer(seconds : float): int
cancelTimer(id : int)

Spoiler

getAxis(axis : int) : int
getNumAxes() : int
getButton(btn : int) : bool
getNumButtons() : int

Spoiler

getResolution() : int, int
getWidth() : int
getHeight() : int
getNumColors() : int
getImage() : image?
setImage(img : image?)

Spoiler

clear(color : int = 0)
floodFill(x, y, color : int) - fills all pixels of the same color connected to `(x, y)`
drawBox(x, y, width, height, color : int)
drawBoxOutline(x, y, width, height, color : int)
drawEllipse(x, y, width, height, color : int)
drawEllipseOutline(x, y, width, height, color : int)
drawImage(x, y : int, img : image, scale : int = 1)
xorImage(x, y : int, img : image, scale : int = 1)
drawLine(x1, y1, x2, y2, color : int)
drawMap(x, y : int, map, tileset : image, scale : int = 1)
drawPixel(x, y, color : int)
drawText(x, y : int, text : string)
drawTriangle(x1, y1, x2, y2, x3, y3, color : int)
drawTriangleOutline(x1, y1, x2, y2, x3, y3, color : int)
newFont(img : image, chars : string, charWidth, charHeight : int) : font
setFont(font : font?)
getFont() : font
measureText(text : string) : int, int
newImage(width, height : int, fill : int = 0) : image
loadTGA(str : string) : image, palette?
loadTGA(handle : handle) : image, palette?
saveTGA(img : image, pal : palette) : string
saveTGA(img : image, pal : palette, handle : handle)
setTarget(target : image?)
getTarget() : image?
getTargetSize() : int, int
getTargetWidth() : int
getTargetHeight() : int
setColorMapping(map : {[int] = int})
setColorMapping(key, val : int)
getColorMapping() : [int]
getColorMapping(color : int) : int
resetColorMapping()
resetColorMapping(color : int)
setTransparentColor(color : int?)
getTransparentColor() : int?
setOffset(x, y : int)
getOffset() : int, int
getPixel(x, y : int) : int
newPalette(size : int) : palette
reset()

Spoiler

blit(x, y : int, img : image) - blit `img` onto `self` at `(x, y)`
copy() : image
fill(color : int)
fill(color, x, y, width, height : int)
flipX()
flipY()
getSize() : int
getHeight() : int
getWidth() : int
read(x, y : int) : int
read(x, y, length : int) : string
write(x, y, colour : int)
write(x, y : int, value : string)
replace(find, replace : int)
rotate90()
rotate180()
rotate270()
sub(x, y, width, height : int) : image
translate(x, y : int, fill : int = 0)

Spoiler

getCharacterImage(chars : string) : image*
getCharacters() : string
getImage() : image
measureText(text : string) : int, int

Spoiler

These are only used for TGA loading/saving currently, though `DisplayDevice` has some fields for it, there aren't any Lua methods for accessing it.

copy() : palette
getSize() : int
getColor(index : int) : float, float, float
setColor(index : int, color : string) - set from a hex color (e.g. #F2B2CC)
setColor(index : int, r, g, b : float)

Spoiler

getMount() : mount
getCapacity() : int

Spoiler

eject()
getMount() : mount?
hasDisk() : bool

Spoiler

getROM() : mount
boot(path : string) - this errors if the CPU is already booted
getStatus() : string - `'halted'` or `'running'`
halt() - this errors is the CPU is already halted

It might be possible to use `boot` and `halt` to boot an arbitrary file:


cpu.halt()
cpu.boot('whatever.lua')

Spoiler

getChannelState(chan : int) : string - `'playing'` or `'stopped'`
getNumChannels() : int
play(sound : sound, chan : int?)
queue(sound : sound, chan : int)
stop() - stop all channels
stop(chan : int)

Sound:

waveform : string = 'square'
volume : float = 1
duration : float
attack : float = 0
decay : float = 0
frequency : float
slide : float = 0
vibrato_depth : float = 0
vibrato_frequency : float = 0
loop : bool = true

oeed, on 28 October 2016 - 05:20 AM said:
Awesome!
For things like Silica which will need to manually draw their pixels, rather than using the GPU, what is the fastest way to draw the entire screen?
Is using drawImage faster than repeatedly calling drawPixel, or does drawImage just call drawPixel itself (like paintuils)?

Canvas/Image/Mask should probably be reimplemented using images, from a quick look through master I can think of ways of implementing everything efficiently.

dan200, on 28 October 2016 - 12:50 AM said:
Hey all,
I've just finished documenting the Robot Arcade part of Redirection, which as you probably know my now, serves as a preview of the CraftOS 2.0 project:
http://steamcommunit...s/?id=788101089
There have already been several Arcade games posted to the workshop, on top of the 3 built into the game:
http://steamcommunit...5D=Arcade+Games
If you want to get in on the action, Redirection is currently 15% off on Steam :)/>/>/>/>
http://store.steampo....com/app/305760
On top of the CraftOS 2.0 preview, you also get a great puzzle game with 100% positive Steam reviews, and help me to pay my rent :P/>/>/>/>

There are quite a few methods missing from the guide, is that intentional?
I can't really see any benefit to the UTF-8 file modes, they just parse as UTF-8 then convert back to an array of bytes which just corrupts non-UTF-8 data.
I also found at least one bug I can remember right now: in `Image.Fill` `x + height` is compared to `Height`, that should be `y + height`.

Edited on 29 October 2016 - 06:53 AM

oeed #747

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 28 October 2016 - 09:42 PM

Memory limit, set at 1MB (not 1MiB) in the arcade

I take it that's memory, not storage. Could be a fun challenge, the Luo compiler is definitely surpassing 2MB at the moment…

Now using Lua 5.3.

rip jit

getModifiedTime, getNameWithoutExtension, mount

Awwww yeahhhhhhh!

getPowerStatus() : string, int - `powerStatus, chargeLevel`, `powerStatus` is either `'unpowered'`, `'charged'`, `'charging'`, `'discharging'` or `'fixed'`

Interesting… seems to hint that Dan has some cool plans for the future!

getTime() : float - time as seconds since 12:00:00 January 1 0001 (0001-01-01T12:00:00.00)
resetTime() - reset the time to UTC

Glad to see we have access to the real world time now, can you explain what is meant by resetTime though? There doesn't seem to be anything to set it. Can you change the timezone?

Interested to see what's possible with the speaker. I haven't done much stuff with sound, but I take it that it's fairly basic?

CoderPuppy #748

CoderPuppy's profile picture

130 posts

Posted 28 October 2016 - 09:50 PM

oeed, on 28 October 2016 - 09:42 PM said:
getTime() : float - time as seconds since 12:00:00 January 1 0001 (0001-01-01T12:00:00.00)
resetTime() - reset the time to UTC
Glad to see we have access to the real world time now, can you explain what is meant by resetTime though? There doesn't seem to be anything to set it. Can you change the timezone?

Right below `resetTime` is `setTime`.

oeed, on 28 October 2016 - 09:42 PM said:
Interested to see what's possible with the speaker. I haven't done much stuff with sound, but I take it that it's fairly basic?

I've no idea.

oeed #749

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 28 October 2016 - 10:03 PM

CoderPuppy, on 28 October 2016 - 09:50 PM said:
Right below `resetTime` is `setTime`.

Facepalm.

cyanisaac #750

cyanisaac's profile picture

385 posts

Location San Diego, CA

Posted 30 October 2016 - 01:41 AM

So with this Arcade mode, are there any restrictions with it as opposed to standard ComputerCraft, or can you make anything with it? (ie missing features, such as maybe certain inputs)

If this is basically CraftOS 2.0 unrestricted within Redirection I'm definitely interested in it.

Bomb Bloke #751

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 30 October 2016 - 01:30 AM

This is merely a preview of CraftOS2.0, intended for the creation of minigames. The display is 64x64 and monochrome (text characters take 4x6px each, including padding). Keyboard input seems to be limited to arrows + Z + X. I don't believe mouse input is accepted. io.open() throws access denied errors when attempting to use write mode, though there's a scoreboard API (that Dan hasn't documented for whatever reason) which can be used to retain a high score between loads.

It isn't event-driven in the manner ComputerCraft is. I'm quite tempted to create a compatibility layer to replicate that old behaviour.

It offers sound (nothing too complex), and a few nifty drawing functions. You can load a picture file and render it where ever you like for eg. Another undocumented function, gpu.setTransparentColor(), is handy for this.

I was able to port across a stripped-down version of my old Tetris script with minimal effort. Debugging can be a little tricky at times, though, given that it often omits line numbers from its errors - though manually adding breakpoints into a script isn't "hard", per se, simply annoying.

ALREADY someone has posted an "OS" for it. It has four menu options - half of them are redundant and the other half non-functional.

CoderPuppy #752

CoderPuppy's profile picture

130 posts

Posted 30 October 2016 - 01:48 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 30 October 2016 - 01:30 AM said:
It isn't event-driven in the manner ComputerCraft is. I'm quite tempted to create a compatibility layer to replicate that old behaviour.

It is, `system.sleep` is implemented as:


function system.sleep( nSeconds )
	expect( nSeconds, "number", 1 )
	local clock = system_getDevice( "clock" )
	if not clock then
		error( "No clock present" )
	end
	local nTimer = clock.startTimer( nSeconds )
	while true do
		local sEvent, p1 = system_pullEvent( "timer" )
		if p1 == nTimer then
			break
		end
	end
end

Bomb Bloke #753

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 30 October 2016 - 02:16 AM

Ah, that's handy then! :)/>

Emma #754

218 posts

Location tmpim

Posted 25 November 2016 - 02:52 AM

I broke it

Spoiler

Bomb Bloke #755

Bomb Bloke's profile picture

7083 posts

Location Tasmania (AU)

Posted 25 November 2016 - 03:15 AM

Yeah they're a few bugs in there (at least, last I checked). Some of them are caused by incorrect calls on your part and really just need a better error message attached to them, others are a bit more dubious. Having some of the drawing functions attempt to plot stuff outside of the visible area can sometimes crash Redirection completely for eg.

Emma #756

218 posts

Location tmpim

Posted 25 November 2016 - 04:05 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 25 November 2016 - 03:15 AM said:
–snip–

Yeah, this one in particular was me trying to load a file at the wrong path, really should have a better error ;P

dan200 #757

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 25 November 2016 - 11:04 AM

Bomb Bloke, on 25 November 2016 - 03:15 AM said:
Yeah they're a few bugs in there (at least, last I checked). Some of them are caused by incorrect calls on your part and really just need a better error message attached to them, others are a bit more dubious. Having some of the drawing functions attempt to plot stuff outside of the visible area can sometimes crash Redirection completely for eg.

Hey all! Can you report all instances of calls which crash Redirection, causes a C# stacktrace to be printed, or otherwise error when they shouldn't here please: https://github.com/dan200/Redirection/issues
As always, minimal reproduction code is best!

Elttob #758

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 27 December 2016 - 02:14 AM

Yay features!

(furiously figuring out ways to exploit the speaker api to produce cool sounds)

EDIT: All done! Using FamiTracker with the current limitations of the speaker api in mind, voila: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/33474309/CraftOS%21.wav

I made the kick drum with some fancy pitch sliding on a triangle channel.

Edited on 27 December 2016 - 01:42 AM

Elttob #759

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 27 December 2016 - 04:21 AM

(not an edit of previous post, since they aren't related)

I redesigned Vertex's interface to work better on the COS2.0 CGA display. Here's a snap:

Same palette as before, but with a much cleaner look. I like the antialiasing effects too; they were largely accidental but worked well in the end :P/>

(except maybe the search icon, I'm not fond of that one)

Edited on 27 December 2016 - 04:11 AM

ScoutCD10 #760

ScoutCD10's profile picture

18 posts

Posted 04 January 2017 - 09:30 PM

Dan promised that after Redirection release,he will start working again on CC2.0 but dan gave no news about CC2.0 so i think CC2.0 is dead for good.
Its been almost 3 months since redirection and we hadnt any news about CC2.0 Progresa

Edited on 04 January 2017 - 08:33 PM

oeed #761

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 05 January 2017 - 12:20 AM

ScoutCD10, on 04 January 2017 - 09:30 PM said:
Dan promised that after Redirection release,he will start working again on CC2.0 but dan gave no news about CC2.0 so i think CC2.0 is dead for good.
Its been almost 3 months since redirection and we hadnt any news about CC2.0 Progresa

Don't think that's really fair to say. He has added some new features to the Redirection arcade, so he might still be working on it. Also keep in mind that he might've simply not been working on anything if he's off on holiday or taking a break.

houseofkraft #762

172 posts

Location USA

Posted 05 January 2017 - 12:32 AM

He could be on holiday but it's taking quite a long time and the alpha hasn't even been released yet and he released his video programming a Pacman 256 in CraftOS 2.0 on Oct 10th in 2015!

dan200 #763

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 06 January 2017 - 11:46 AM

I have not ceased work on the new project, in fact: I finally have a concrete design planned out for what the full project is beyond the "virtual computer" at it's core. However, i've also been spending time on Redirection updates and looking for a job, as my funds are low at the moment and Redirection hasn't proved profitable enough to fund the next project on it's own.

(And yes, I took a few weeks off for Christmas)

dan200 #764

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 06 January 2017 - 12:03 PM

The plan at the moment (finances pending), is to release a prototype as soon as I can containing the bare minimum functionality of the full game, and then submit it to Steam Greenlight. If that passes, I'd like to release the game on Steam Early Access and develop it in the open from there on out.

TheRockettek #765

726 posts

Location Rem is best girl

Posted 06 January 2017 - 12:37 PM

should of made a kickstarter for redirection :^)

dan200 #766

524 posts

Location Cambridge, England

Posted 06 January 2017 - 02:59 PM

A KS for the new thing isn't a terrible idea honestly.

mseyne #767

mseyne's profile picture

1 posts

Posted 09 January 2017 - 06:44 AM

Hello dan200, sorry to hear that your Redirection game didn't return enough profit to stay afloat on your own projects. (I just took a copy on steam, mostly for the arcade robot mini computer, but love the game too :)/> )

I just registered to say to you that I would gladly support your project on KS.

I am a pico-8 user (a fantasy console with a very active community which I believe is composed also of old computercraft fans/hackers), it is perfect for little arcade games and I dream about a kind of fantasy computer in the spirit of computercraft but in stand alone from minecraft with a plateform a bit a mix between this forum/pastbin export and the cartridge/png/splore of pico 8 to share programs on disk (not only based on steam/workshop). Well, I am pretty sure I am not alone on this, the commodore 64 / apple 2 homebrew hackers are out there and they would love a creative platform / community like this, I am sure. (and I am not even talking about the educational side of it in computing or the ease of access on cheap computer like raspberry pi or chip)

If your next project happen to be a stand alone ComputerCraft 2 with an integrated CraftOs 2 + SDK, I am pretty sure you would have a kickstarter success, then a sharing and creative community expanded and enough funds for creative freedom.

Hope you the best for your next projects.
M

Edit : Of course, to prepare a good kickstarter campaign ask a lot of energy, so I don't know what would be the most adapted to your needs, an other crowdfunding method like patreon ?

Edited on 09 January 2017 - 01:13 PM

oeed #768

oeed's profile picture

2151 posts

Location Auckland, New Zealand

Posted 17 January 2017 - 11:58 AM

dan200, on 06 January 2017 - 02:59 PM said:
A KS for the new thing isn't a terrible idea honestly.

I would 100% support you on Kickstarter. It's also a good way to allow people to contribute more if they're able. Some people mightn't be able to contribute more than a few dollars. Personally, given enough details about it I honestly think I would be willing to pay something like $50 - $100 to help.

The fact that you mentioned putting it on Steam is interesting. If it is a game, and even if it isn't really, it does make sense somewhat to get more customers. I wouldn't be completely set on relying on Steam though for something like this. By its very nature it is the kind of thing that people want to be flexible. That's why emulators were always in such demand. Having to run a game in order to work on a project (especially when on a laptop) can be a bit annoying.

FoxData #769

231 posts

Posted 17 January 2017 - 04:25 PM

dan200, on 06 January 2017 - 12:03 PM said:
The plan at the moment (finances pending), is to release a prototype as soon as I can containing the bare minimum functionality of the full game, and then submit it to Steam Greenlight. If that passes, I'd like to release the game on Steam Early Access and develop it in the open from there on out.

Minecraft mods are meant to be free!

SquidDev #770

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 17 January 2017 - 04:31 PM

FoxData, on 17 January 2017 - 04:25 PM said:
dan200, on 06 January 2017 - 12:03 PM said:
The plan at the moment (finances pending), is to release a prototype as soon as I can containing the bare minimum functionality of the full game, and then submit it to Steam Greenlight. If that passes, I'd like to release the game on Steam Early Access and develop it in the open from there on out.

Minecraft mods are meant to be free!

I don't want to get too deep into the paid modding argument but, whilst Minecraft mods are legally required to be free, if that requirement was removed, I see no reason that people shouldn't charge for mods. Seeing as it is pretty clear now that CraftOS 2.0 has nothing to do with Minecraft, there is no reason that Dan shouldn't charge for this.

Also worth noting that CraftOS 2.0 is just a placeholder name. As Dan admits, it is a little confusing :)/>.

Anfred #771

Anfred's profile picture

22 posts

Posted 26 January 2017 - 02:05 PM

"In CraftOS2.0, something that would be helpful would be if every virtual computer (assuming it works like this) has an unmodifiable (constant) unique identifier. I think this could be useful for certain things.

Wouldn't os.getComputerID do what you want? Or do you mean unique as in all my virtual computers have a different identifiers to your ones?

Completely unique, so my computers would have different IDs to yours. That way services could utilize it to keep track of one computer from any other one."

Reply: Congratulations! Your brain just re-invented Bitcoin. Decetralized peer to peer payments are the best and only way electronic payments should be made. There are hundreds of ways to convert cash into bitcoin. And yes, craftOS2 SHOULD have Bitcoin transactions, but nobody is nagging Dan (or paying Dan) to do so. Bitcoin support would expand the # of devs infinitely!

Edited on 26 January 2017 - 01:23 PM

apemanzilla #772

apemanzilla's profile picture

1610 posts

Posted 26 January 2017 - 02:23 PM

Anfred, on 26 January 2017 - 02:05 PM said:
"Well yeah at the moment we don't know whether there is support for multiple computers. I'd be somewhat surprised if there isn't though.

Wouldn't os.getComputerID do what you want? Or do you mean unique as in all my virtual computers have a different identifiers to your ones?

Completely unique, so my computers would have different IDs to yours. That way services could utilize it to keep track of one computer from any other one.

In CraftOS2.0, something that would be helpful would be if every virtual computer (assuming it works like this) has an unmodifiable (constant) unique identifier. I think this could be useful for certain things.

Well yeah at the moment we don't know whether there is support for multiple computers. I'd be somewhat surprised if there isn't though.

Wouldn't os.getComputerID do what you want? Or do you mean unique as in all my virtual computers have a different identifiers to your ones?

Completely unique, so my computers would have different IDs to yours. That way services could utilize it to keep track of one computer from any other one."

Reply: Congratulations! Your brain just re-invented Bitcoin! Decetralized peer to peer payments are the best and only way electronic payments should be made! Good thinking! There are hundreds of ways to convert cash into bitcoin. And yes, craftOS2 SHOULD have Bitcoin transactions, but nobody is nagging Dan (or paying Dan) to do so. Bitcoin support would expand the # of devs infinitely!

Wat.

Anfred #773

Anfred's profile picture

22 posts

Posted 26 January 2017 - 02:27 PM

Lol phone typing quotes is hard. The point is Bitcoin for craftOS 2 is a great idea. Imagine the Google play store without Google. A p2p decentralized network for file sharing and payment processing made up of craftOS 2.0 apps. Lookup the word blockchain for more explanation.

Edited on 26 January 2017 - 01:31 PM

3d6 #774

3d6's profile picture

350 posts

Posted 26 January 2017 - 02:41 PM

Bitcoin is a cryptocurrency. You are describing a cooperative storage cloud, like Sia or Storj, which also utilize blockchains.

Anfred #775

Anfred's profile picture

22 posts

Posted 26 January 2017 - 02:47 PM

dan200, on 06 January 2017 - 02:59 PM said:
A KS for the new thing isn't a terrible idea honestly.

If I had a bunch of money, I would pay u to release craftOS 2.0 on all platforms. Make a mobile Android/iOS version as a "backer reward" on Kickstarter and I will happily pay $20 for that reward option. Say it will support Bitcoin transactions and watch the whole thing spin wildly out of control from the amount of interest! Bitcoin devs are real thirsty for new ways to use blockchain tech. Game devs are real thirsty for solo dev environments. Combine the 2 through crowd funding and it's a mountain of cash!

Edited on 26 January 2017 - 01:50 PM

Anfred #776

Anfred's profile picture

22 posts

Posted 26 January 2017 - 02:54 PM

3d6, on 26 January 2017 - 02:41 PM said:
Bitcoin is a cryptocurrency. You are describing a cooperative storage cloud, like Sia or Storj, which also utilize blockchains.

Yup. The point is you need both to have a proper store: crypto currency and blockchain file storage.

InternetUnexplorer #777

24 posts

Location no

Posted 26 January 2017 - 03:25 PM

apemanzilla, on 26 January 2017 - 02:23 PM said:
Wat.

My thoughts exactly.

Edited on 26 January 2017 - 02:26 PM

Cross_Sans #778

Cross_Sans's profile picture

122 posts

Location France

Posted 26 January 2017 - 07:33 PM

MindenCucc, on 19 May 2015 - 08:27 PM said:
It looks like graphics.com ported to ComputerCraft :P/> graphics.setMode(19)? :D/>

I also think of :3

Cross_Sans #779

Cross_Sans's profile picture

122 posts

Location France

Posted 26 January 2017 - 07:41 PM

The "CraftOS 2.0" of this project is for game development. I am really sure of that.
The font of this project is also thinking me of Apple IIgs font.

Edited on 29 January 2017 - 08:25 AM

SquidDev #780

SquidDev's profile picture

1426 posts

Location Does anyone put something serious here?

Posted 10 February 2017 - 07:00 PM

Possibly CraftOS 2.0 related, possibly not.

On the flipside: I guess my next game will hit Early Access in a few months! I was previously going to wait for it to be "greenlight ready"

With only two grains of sand remaining, we're getting closer. Interestingly, a couple of months will bring us pretty close to this thread's two year anniversary.

IliasHDZ #781

IliasHDZ's profile picture

16 posts

Location Mechelen, Antwerp, Belgium

Posted 11 March 2017 - 04:32 PM

Best tweet dan ever posted.

Yarillo #782

82 posts

Location France

Posted 12 March 2017 - 03:24 PM

TL;DR:

ComputerCraft is going opensource
Dan200 is rejoining Frontier Developments (Planet coaster, elite dangerous)
CraftOS 2.0 is on the way

KidBrine #783

KidBrine's profile picture

73 posts

Location Hoquiam Wa

Posted 06 April 2017 - 11:54 PM

"It's been 5 and a half years since I wrote the first line of CC code, and while it's been life changing, it's time to put down the pickaxe."
-Dantwohundered

Edited on 06 April 2017 - 09:58 PM

Gumball #784

Gumball's profile picture

276 posts

Location Fairbanks, Alaska

Posted 15 June 2017 - 07:30 AM

It's been awhile. No updates? Anyone have any clarity on this? Thanks.

Wilma456 #785

188 posts

Location Germany

Posted 15 June 2017 - 10:41 AM

You can download the Source Code here and built CC. Craft OS 2.0 is not aviable, but there are many new features.

Gumball #786

Gumball's profile picture

276 posts

Location Fairbanks, Alaska

Posted 16 June 2017 - 02:56 AM

I'm asking about CraftOS 2.0, not CC.

Dave-ee Jones #787

Dave-ee Jones's profile picture

467 posts

Location Van Diemen's Land

Posted 07 July 2017 - 06:27 AM

CraftOS 2.0 seems to have not been worked on for quite the while. Dan hasn't mentioned it in his Twitter for weeks (months maybe? Can't be bothered checking all his posts..). I hope he releases it..His Pacman 256 game looked really polished compared to what we can do with CraftOS 1.8..

Anyone heard anything?

ScoutCD10 #788

ScoutCD10's profile picture

18 posts

Posted 07 July 2017 - 09:17 AM

https://twitter.com/DanTwoHundred/status/880537849782689792

Dan said : "LIKO-12 is looking great,i wish i had more time to work on my virtual computer"

This means that Dan doesn't have a lot of time to work on CraftOS 2.0 and the development is slow because of that!

Dave-ee Jones #789

Dave-ee Jones's profile picture

467 posts

Location Van Diemen's Land

Posted 20 July 2017 - 07:09 AM

ScoutCD10, on 07 July 2017 - 09:17 AM said:
https://twitter.com/...537849782689792

Dan said : "LIKO-12 is looking great,i wish i had more time to work on my virtual computer"

This means that Dan doesn't have a lot of time to work on CraftOS 2.0 and the development is slow because of that!

I was wondering what the hourglass meant..Now I know.

I honestly don't see anything in the CC license that says you can't edit it..Isn't that what LIKO-12 was doing or was it because he was doing it under another name (not ComputerCraft, but LIKO-12)?

KingofGamesYami #790

3057 posts

Location United States of America

Posted 20 July 2017 - 12:02 PM

https://github.com/RamiLego4Game/LIKO-12

Dave-ee Jones #791

Dave-ee Jones's profile picture

467 posts

Location Van Diemen's Land

Posted 20 July 2017 - 11:55 PM

KingofGamesYami, on 20 July 2017 - 12:02 PM said:
https://github.com/R...go4Game/LIKO-12

Are you saying it was because it had nothing to do with ComputerCraft but something completely different, while using some of CC's code with no referencing?

RamiLego4Game #792

RamiLego4Game's profile picture

46 posts

Location Syria,Damascus

Posted 30 August 2017 - 03:25 PM

Dave-ee Jones, on 20 July 2017 - 07:09 AM said:
ScoutCD10, on 07 July 2017 - 09:17 AM said:
https://twitter.com/...537849782689792

Dan said : "LIKO-12 is looking great,i wish i had more time to work on my virtual computer"

This means that Dan doesn't have a lot of time to work on CraftOS 2.0 and the development is slow because of that!

I was wondering what the hourglass meant..Now I know.

I honestly don't see anything in the CC license that says you can't edit it..Isn't that what LIKO-12 was doing or was it because he was doing it under another name (not ComputerCraft, but LIKO-12)?

It was quite confusing, I just used the pastebin program code from CC, and added references to it, but dan200 warned me about license issues, so I removed that and switched to use pastebin code from OC

Edited on 30 August 2017 - 01:28 PM

Elttob #793

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 29 September 2017 - 08:39 PM

Welp, it's been a long time since I've been here. CraftOS 2 is still not out ;-;
To suppress this crippling withdrawal (kek) I decided to completely redesign my operating system idea, from scratch. Now it looks pretty modern and isn't tightly cramped, which is cool!

The reason why I've now decided to abandon windows is that, as usual, screen area is a limited resource. Even with a bitmapped screen to play around with, there's simply no room for windows without compromises. The minimum resolution I would consider suitable for windows is VGA 640x480, where there is enough area to fit a decent amount of content within several windowed areas. It even allows for greater flexibility with font choice and UI element sizing. For now, however, the constraint is CGA 320x200, which I think is best suited to fullscreen applications. For that reason, I've designed this interface as a tablet-style interface.

It also draws on the rudimentary antialiasing techniques that I presented previously. This allows for smoother vector graphics and icons, and you can see it almost everywhere (the internet connection icon next to the clock, the rounded corners on the application tiles, the line icons, and so on). The reason why it's not additionally applied to the text is that this would decrease legibility, which is vital with low-resolution fonts which already have to be beaten into shape down to the last pixel to achieve good results. The font in the image is the same one used as in all my other concepts and is 6 pixels tall only.

Edit; I'm working on optimising these interfaces. Don't mind the large monospace font; that's Elt Monoma, a monospace font I made for higher resolution displays. It's all I had at the time.

Edited on 30 September 2017 - 04:36 PM

Elttob #794

Elttob's profile picture

22 posts

Location London, UK

Posted 01 October 2017 - 12:25 PM

I've been working on those designs and optimising them for functionality, now that I have the general look I want.

Firstly, I've hand-crafted a brand new monospace font, made from scratch for the command prompt. Enter;

Viva Mono is a simple, small monospace font which is quite readable (with a large x-height) and it's available under the CC-BY-NC-SA license for non-commercial use: get the TTF here. It works best at 6px, without antialiasing.
Viva Mono is likely the first small font in a family of small fonts, all of which are designed and optimised to work well in CraftOS 2.0, or similar CGA environments.

Here's what the prompt looks like with Viva Mono:

I've also been working on the launch menu. I've adjusted the padding of the tray elements on the launch menu to line up with the tray elements while in another screen, meaning smoother animation when we get there. I've also revised the design of the app tiles; they're now more compact and it's clearer that the menu continues off-screen, rather than hiding the unused rows. There's also a pretty neat menu for when you click on your avatar. Take a look:

Other than those user-facing changes, I'm starting to work on the internals, such as the dispatcher and resource management.

Dave-ee Jones #795

Dave-ee Jones's profile picture

467 posts

Location Van Diemen's Land

Posted 02 October 2017 - 12:20 AM

That is really nice. Reminds me of Nintendo for some reason (Switch, maybe?)

I don't know about that Recent Window thing though, downscaling a whole screen by replacing pixels is very hard to do efficiently and for any amount of pixels. I don't think it wise.

However I do like the desktop, explorer and start menu. Very nice.

I hope CraftOS 2.0 comes with some general optimisations because I wouldn't mind legitimately using it as a lightweight Lua OS for a phone or something like that (like launching the OS from a Lua Emu or something). It would be (almost) outside the normal OS' which means undetected because you've programmed all the data it sends out and receives from scratch. It could be like an in-house OS that you're family uses or something to communicate outside of generic apps and stuff.

Not to mention something you built from scratch so it makes you feel really good using it :P/>

Edited on 01 October 2017 - 10:23 PM

InDieTasten #796

355 posts

Location Germany

Posted 17 February 2018 - 12:13 AM

I guess still nothingness?

Emma #797

218 posts

Location tmpim

Posted 17 February 2018 - 05:36 PM

InDieTasten, on 17 February 2018 - 12:13 AM said:
I guess still nothingness?

Unfortunately yes. However, if you are looking for some alternatives, there are various programs which have a similar feel. Some examples include LIKO-12, PICO-8, or my personal favorite: TIC-80.

LeDark Lua #798

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 02 October 2018 - 05:34 PM

Creating a VM like CraftOS2 but you can code everything from scratch… even the consoles and stuff!

I was inspired by Elttob here.

Edited on 02 October 2018 - 03:35 PM

LeDark Lua #799

599 posts

Location LeLua

Posted 04 October 2018 - 01:38 PM

Soooo… I dunno if someone is seeing this, but if someone want's to help with the Virtual Machine project, I made a GitHub Repo here. Who will help add your name to the CREDITS table.